Rumble on the Pike 2009

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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Whiter Hydra »

wexs883198215 wrote:Anyways, are individual stats going to be posted?
They're in that Word document.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by t-bar »

RyuAqua wrote:
Journey to the Planets wrote:
wexs883198215 wrote:
Journey to the Planets wrote:
RyuAqua wrote:
Journey to the Planets wrote: Going 0 for two rounds against Matt Jackson isn't fun.
I don't know why you're singling me out... :wink:
...Because you specifically kept getting the questions I expected to get?
Was Matt Jackson being pretty darn good at quizbowl....unexpected???
Okay, so not "expected," but "usually get against other reasonably good teams".
Hey, maybe it's just me, but 7.92 points per game isn't exactly "pretty darn good" ... :wink:

Anyway, Kuo-Kai, individual stats are in the document that Raj attached to his results post.
Oh right...Phillip.

EDIT for useful content:
Like Matt said, I was highly surprised and impressed by Blair's performance today, especially since they don't do quizbowl much. I was also impressed by Walter Johnson: they were definitely underrated in the preseason rankings and poll. They proved today that they can still win a lot of games sans Daichi.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by wexs883198215 »

Earthquake wrote:
wexs883198215 wrote:Anyways, are individual stats going to be posted?
They're in that Word document.
Oops. Thanks :grin:
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by The King's Flight to the Scots »

Hm, I appear to have gone from 0 negs at MATT at the end of last year to 25 negs today. I should probably fix that.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by wexs883198215 »

Well NAQT forces you to play slightly differently, wouldn't you say?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by wexs883198215 »

By the way, how did you guys handle the Hammond situation? I see some scores like 330 to 0 against them along with a lot of 10 to 0s. And did those impact points per game for teams and players?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Self-incompatibility in plants »

Okay. Some initial comments about some things I noticed:

-I think we played pretty poorly, and I made a lot of mistake in the day, however we still did not do too terribly somehow.
-I had no idea Blair was that good. They really came out of no where and impressed me.
-WJ is much, much, better than I expected they would be.
- St. Anselm's and GDS were as good as I expected them to be.
-Speaking of St. Anselm's, it is amazing how good Matt got over the summer. A true meteoric rise.

Some general thoughts about the tournament and set:

-I know it was not RM's fault that we could not get in, but still, being locked out for that long, and getting started that late was really annoying.
-When considering how late we got started, we still got to play 11 games of quiz bowl, and still get out before 6, which was great and exemplifies how this tournament was well run.
-In the end, this tournament ended up being a good one. The bracketing system ended up being good, and did a great job with the logistics. Initially, I had some worries after some disconcerning declarations made by the RM crew, but in the end, they pulled it off with flying colors. Nice job guys, thanks for a good first tournament.

-I am really happy to see NAQT working to improve the quality of their questions. For NAQT, these questions were great, and I was really satisfied with them. I can say with confidence that I will still would prefer to play on HSAPQ, but if this trend of increasing set quality continues, then I think the biggest reason that I will still prefer HSAPQ is the fact that I am better at them (rather than NAQT questions being poor quality). There still is work to be done (Aidan brought up some things that came up that should not be there), but kudos to NAQT, for taking steps in the right direction.

So yea, this was a really good day. Most importantly, it showed me and my team just how much work we need to do to get to where we need to be to stay competitive with the best teams in the nation. For the fact that it was a reality slap in the fast, I will regard it as a good first experience for the 09-10 season.

Congrats to GDS, St. Anselm's, TJ, and WJ for a really a good showing today.
Trey Taraila
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Important Bird Area »

RyuAqua wrote:-I was impressed with the overall quality of this set. IS-86 is a definite, measurable improvement over past previous IS-sets, with better, more academic questions. There was a small contingent of wonky bonuses, some repeats, and a bit of fixation on one particular country, but in this set the questions with issues were exceptions and weren't nearly as commonplace as before. I endorse the use of IS-sets for regular season tournaments if the quality remains at this level or improves.
I'm delighted to hear this.

Everyone: please send me email (jthoppes -at- berkeley -dot- edu) identifying the repeats, bad leadins, country fixation, whatever. I'll put some fixes in before this set is used again next weekend.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Nine-Tenths Ideas »

This will definitely set the standard for future RM tourneys. Questions were a little wonky but much improved, save for a few "screw you" bonuses- a running joke that they seemed especially to crop up in the first game. Observations-
-GDS is indeed very, very good.
-So is St. Anselm's.
-Blair is indeed a surprise- I hear that they had a rather bad game against us.
-But more surprising is WJ. Very, very surprising. Also much better than expected.
-TJ is still very good.
-CR also did pretty well here for being undermanned.

Also, I take home the neg prize with pride. Good tournament.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Kouign Amann »

Is there any way to get some kind of round report for the stats?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Nine-Tenths Ideas »

Prof.Whoopie wrote:Is there any way to get some kind of round report for the stats?
There's a semblance of one at the bottom of the document, but as for something more complicated, I dunno.
EDIT: Upon further inspection, it isn't complete.
Last edited by Nine-Tenths Ideas on Sat Sep 12, 2009 10:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Important Bird Area »

Prof.Whoopie wrote:One thing though: I thought "X, Y, both, or neither" bonuses had been eliminated from NAQT sets, along with "list five things for five points each, five point bonus for all of them," but that could be me misremembering something. I heard one of each type today.
I'm reasonably sure these are in the "discouraged but not eliminated" category (unlike, say, the 30-20-10, which is dead and buried). That being said: I personally wouldn't approve an X/Y/Bovine/Russian aircraft bonus for history myself.

Let me write to the NAQT members list and solicit people's opinions on various non-standard bonus formats.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Important Bird Area »

Aldo Montoya wrote:save for a few "screw you" bonuses- a running joke that they seemed especially to crop up in the first game.
Please send me the details- we'd very much like to fix this, both in the sense of:

-rooting out bonus parts that were too hard for IS and should have been saved for HSNCT

and

-evening out bonus difficulty between rounds if the harder stuff seemed to clump in a particular packet
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by at your pleasure »

I'd like to join the chorus of praise for this tournament. I was less enamored of the set than others, but I also never saw IS-85 or last year's HSNCT. I suppose it's a decent-to-good sign that most of my qualms were with the occasional-but-freqent-enough-to-be-annoying weird answer line and/or distributional quirks(espcially since most any category that you don't know well will seem overrepresented). Also, two other things: The "Screw you" bonuses were also often weird answer lines and the worst questions seemed to cluster in the first two rounds, so it went from "dear god" after packet two to "this is not my favorite set, but it's prefectly good" after round 10 or so.
Results suprises:
WJ-I said that they were the wildcard. Prehaps dark horse would have been better.
Blair-Didn't play them but was suprised by their bonus conversion. If they play more tournaments, they'll definite make one heck of a racket.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by aestheteboy »

people wrote:Wow what a shock WJ is decent!
What did I tell ya about KK.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Self-incompatibility in plants »

aestheteboy wrote:
people wrote:Wow what a shock WJ is decent!
What did I tell ya about KK.
The community apologies for ever doubting you or KK.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

I'll reiterate that these questions were better than i expected. Still the silly trash and general knowledge garbage, but overall this was one of the best NAQT sets i've ever seen, and that's even counting that i dislike NAQT "format" more just about every day. For what this was, it turned out quite well. More academic questions, more good lead-ins... a really decently-produced set. Thanks to R. and Jeff and company for really working hard and clearly improving the quality of the rounds here. It makes me feel better about the future of NAQT.

Quick notes, i'm falling asleep as i type this.

St. Anselm's is that good. The sky is the limit for these guys this year.

Matt Jackson knows his quizbowl. And apparently has players to help. GDS is the real deal, y'all. Congrats today, guys.

Surprised on Blair, but that's great. Hope they continue to improve. Sounds like that was a great game between CR A and them.

TJ A is all kinds of awesome and will get even more kinds of awesome probably pretty soon.

Gonzaga did real well for people just assuming they would collapse off the face of the earth without Puma. Nope, they're pretty good.

Isaac i mean Biff on Blake i mean Hill Valley is even better, and a supporting cast would help bigtime. Saw him get 175 in a game today.

Kuo-Kai did great, and with his teammates Walter Johnson is still a very formidable squad. Nobody should take them lightly whatsoever. He's/they're just going to get better and better.

Reading was fun. I was glad to help, guys. Anytime. We'll see a bunch of you in a couple weeks at College Park.
Mr. Andrew Chrzanowski
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by chatt_r »

Aldo Montoya wrote:
Prof.Whoopie wrote:Is there any way to get some kind of round report for the stats?
There's a semblance of one at the bottom of the document, but as for something more complicated, I dunno.
EDIT: Upon further inspection, it isn't complete.
The person we had scoring did not enter the all round numbers into the statistics. I think some of the readers did not write it on the top of the scoresheet and as the rounds started piling up he lost track. I didn't notice this until right now.
In order to do a round by round breakdown I'll have to go through the schedule and find the correct match-ups for each round and organize them accordingly.
Unfortunately, I really can't do that at this point tonight, and I'll be out until the afternoon tomorrow.
However, I'll get the round breakdown up as soon as I can.
Thanks for your patience.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by at your pleasure »

Would it be helpful if people sent in lists of their games sorted by round?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by chatt_r »

So here's the situation:
Because we changed the bracketing right before the tournament, I don't have the modified schedule or a list of the finalists at home, so I can't post the last few rounds until I find a copy.
Therefore, it would be very helpful if you could tell me who you played, but please don't feel obligated.
Again, I apologize for the delay.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Kouign Amann »

In the playoffs:

Round 8:
St. Anselm's v GDS A
Hill Valley v TJ B
Walter Johnson v CR A
TJ A v Blair

Round 9:
TJ A v CR A
St. Anselm's v Blair
Hill Valley v GDS A
Walter Johnson v TJ B

Round 10:
St. Anselm's v CR A
TJ A v TJ B
Walter Johnson v GDS A
Hill Valley v Blair

Round 11:
Walter Johnson v Blair
St. Anselm's v TJ B
TJ A v GDS A
Hill Valley v CR A
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Kouign Amann »

In the consolations:

Round 8:
Whitman A v Gonzaga
GDS B v Langley
CR B v Whitman B
Churchill v Hammond (bye)

Round 9:
GDS B v Whitman B
Whitman A v Langley
Churchill v Gonzaga
CR B v Hammond (bye)

Round 10:
Whitman A v Whitman B
CR B v Gonzaga
GDS B v Hammond (bye)
Churchill v Langley

Round 11:
Churchill v Gonzaga
GDS B v Whitman B
CR B v Langley
Whitman A v Hammond (bye)
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

Somewhat innocent question that may have been answered already but i'm not sure...

Why exactly was SQBS not used to keep track of stats in this tournament? This document is a little odd to parse though, and not very helpful in analyzing individual player performances in games, or really even the separate games themselves.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by AlphaQuizBowler »

Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Somewhat innocent question that may have been answered already but i'm not sure...

Why exactly was SQBS not used to keep track of stats in this tournament? This document is a little odd to parse though, and not very helpful in analyzing individual player performances in games, or really even the separate games themselves.
SQBS (or, perhaps, a similar stat program) must have been used, as the document looks exactly what you'd get if you copied the SQBS report and pasted it into a Word document. So I guess a better question would be, Why not post it as an SQBS web report?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Auks Ran Ova »

AlphaQuizBowler wrote:
Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Somewhat innocent question that may have been answered already but i'm not sure...

Why exactly was SQBS not used to keep track of stats in this tournament? This document is a little odd to parse though, and not very helpful in analyzing individual player performances in games, or really even the separate games themselves.
SQBS (or, perhaps, a similar stat program) must have been used, as the document looks exactly what you'd get if you copied the SQBS report and pasted it into a Word document. So I guess a better question would be, Why not post it as an SQBS web report?
Yeah, this is just the SQBS quickprints. I'm not sure why they were copied and pasted into a word doc when there's already a handy "create web report" feature in SQBS that would take maybe ten extra seconds to use, then upload.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Kouign Amann »

Ukonvasara wrote:
AlphaQuizBowler wrote:
Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Somewhat innocent question that may have been answered already but i'm not sure...

Why exactly was SQBS not used to keep track of stats in this tournament? This document is a little odd to parse though, and not very helpful in analyzing individual player performances in games, or really even the separate games themselves.
SQBS (or, perhaps, a similar stat program) must have been used, as the document looks exactly what you'd get if you copied the SQBS report and pasted it into a Word document. So I guess a better question would be, Why not post it as an SQBS web report?
Yeah, this is just the SQBS quickprints. I'm not sure why they were copied and pasted into a word doc when there's already a handy "create web report" feature in SQBS that would take maybe ten extra seconds to use, then upload.
I hear from the RM people that SQBS was being weird or something and that prevented the making of a web report. I don't know the specifics of the incident, but I am told that a real SQBS page will be up soon.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

Thanks Aidan. It'll be really helpful if that happens soon. Good stats are good.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by chatt_r »

I'm trying to post the SQBS file, but
1. It won't accept a data file and
2. If I "make web report" and try to upload the HTML file, it identifies it as a potential attack vector and won't let me upload it.
Anyone know what to do?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Matt Weiner »

Post to http://tc.scobo.net/tc/tcapp/new.aspx instead of here.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by chatt_r »

The results are posted here:
http://results.scobo.net/SQBS.aspx?org= ... =standings
Thanks to Matt Weiner and Dwight Wynne for helping with the posting.
If you have any questions/complaints/requests regarding the stats or the tournament, feel free to ask.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Whiter Hydra »

Why did some rounds have 22 TUs read and others 23?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Nine-Tenths Ideas »

Earthquake wrote:Why did some rounds have 22 TUs read and others 23?
This was a side-effect of snipping out comp. math from all the packets. Some had 2 comp math, others had 1.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

Stats are a little screwy with that scab team of "Hammond" that ended up not showing up. Trey can elaborate, but there are games where scores were entered, and others where only 10 was entered. It's really messing up the individual stats, and for some people their averages will be as many as 10ppg higher if the real scores and stats from the game that that team played was entered.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Self-incompatibility in plants »

Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Stats are a little screwy with that scab team of "Hammond" that ended up not showing up. Trey can elaborate, but there are games where scores were entered, and others where only 10 was entered. It's really messing up the individual stats, and for some people their averages will be as many as 10ppg higher if the real scores and stats from the game that that team played was entered.
For MOST of the Hammond games, which were byes, the stats are entered in as having 22 or 23 TUH, while having only 1 question answered for the team playing the scab team. It's not a major deal, but if there is any value in accurate Stats keeping, then something should probably be done about this. Just an example of how much this affects individual stats, my personal stats from that game say that I scored 90 points in that game, not 10 as it says in the official stats, so my real points per game for the day should be about 7 points higher (if my quick math is correct). The best thing to do would be for all of the stats to be entered for the teams receiving the bye (toss ups, bonuses, the whole works). However, a quicker and easier solution would be for the the total TUH heard for the game be entered as only 1, rather than 23. Granted that solution is not the most accurate, it is by far the easiest option. Also, it seems that real stats were kept for teams against Hammond for the first 4 rounds, but after that accurate stats were not kept for teams going against the scab, which is an inconstancy that really should not have happened and gives an even bigger reason for fixing these stats for all teams. I have no experience with these programs yet, and make no claim to be good at statistics, so if any of this is infeasible or ridiculously complicated to do, or if I am completely wrong with these seeming inaccuracies in individual stats, then I am sorry, and deserve to be completely ignored, but if I am right about this, and it's possible to fix, then it would be nice to see this issue corrected.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by cvdwightw »

Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Stats are a little screwy with that scab team of "Hammond" that ended up not showing up. Trey can elaborate, but there are games where scores were entered, and others where only 10 was entered. It's really messing up the individual stats, and for some people their averages will be as many as 10ppg higher if the real scores and stats from the game that that team played was entered.
There is a little checkbox marked "Forfeit" in the lower right-hand corner right next to the "Next" button. This is how we typically deal with teams that don't show up for a match.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Self-incompatibility in plants »

cvdwightw wrote:
Dr. Isaac Yankem, DDS wrote:Stats are a little screwy with that scab team of "Hammond" that ended up not showing up. Trey can elaborate, but there are games where scores were entered, and others where only 10 was entered. It's really messing up the individual stats, and for some people their averages will be as many as 10ppg higher if the real scores and stats from the game that that team played was entered.
There is a little checkbox marked "Forfeit" in the lower right-hand corner right next to the "Next" button. This is how we typically deal with teams that don't show up for a match.
That works.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by AlphaQuizBowler »

You could also set the scab team as an exhibition team, thus showing their games without affecting the stats of actual teams and players.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

So, yeah, were these stats ever fixed correctly?

And was the SQBS file ever sent to NAQT for their results webpage?

EDIT: Also, this:
NAQT wrote:Results. The host must submit full results [to NAQT] within seven days of the end of the tournament.
http://www.naqt.com/official-event.html
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by MahoningQuizBowler »

http://www.naqt.com/stats/tournament-te ... nt_id=3097

This reflects the revised SQBS with Hammond games changed to forfeits.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Nine-Tenths Ideas »

MahoningQuizBowler wrote:http://www.naqt.com/stats/tournament-te ... nt_id=3097

This reflects the revised SQBS with Hammond games changed to forfeits.
That's not right either; it does not have the complete individual stats- instead it has the stats from the prelims for 12 or 11 games and everyone's PPG is much lower.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

Was looking through NAQT and found...

Isaac had the 44th best game on an IS/HSNCT set of all time... and i moderated this one! 0-18-1 for 152.2 PP20TUH.

Matt had the 24th best tournament average on an IS/HSNCT of all time... 103.2 PP20TUH.

Yay.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by AKKOLADE »

They're no Basileus, or Neil Samadder.
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Kouign Amann »

Was PACE affiliation status ever confirmed for this event?
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by The King's Flight to the Scots »

Prof.Whoopie wrote:Was PACE affiliation status ever confirmed for this event?

http://pace-nsc.org/qualified09.htm
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Rufous-capped Thornbill »

FredMorlan wrote:They're no Basileus, or Neil Samadder.
I don't think anyone will ever top Neil's 12-0-1 game. :roll:
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Re: Rumble on the Pike 2009

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

The all-time record (at least, that NAQT has documented) is Charlie Rosenthal's 7-9-0 (in 18 questions) performance from last year's Sagacity.

http://www.naqt.com/stats/individual-ga ... fficulty=1
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