Kentucky 09-10

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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

I would love to see a state-wide JV tournament played on high quality quizbowl questions (HSAPQ is what I would suggest.)
I believe we could host this if the fall tournament goes well.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Whiter Hydra »

I believe that Maggie Walker will be hosting HAVOC again next year; you guys should see if you could mirror that tournament.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

That's a good idea.
We have thought about going to HAVOC, but could not, due to the nearly 500 mile trip.
I will ask Sarah about mirroring it later on this year.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by J C Bennett »

Sandy: thanks for the classy post. Let's move forward.
Nick: The Board discussed this at its retreat Monday. Odds are very good JV Challenge will have a state-level second competition. Probably not this year, but almost certainly next. You're right there definitely is a gap in the market.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

J C Bennett wrote:Sandy: thanks for the classy post. Let's move forward.
Nick: The Board discussed this at its retreat Monday. Odds are very good JV Challenge will have a state-level second competition. Probably not this year, but almost certainly next. You're right there definitely is a gap in the market.
That's definitely good news to hear.

Scott, I don't think an indivdual school should host a statewide JV Championship, which is why I don't really like the idea of Grayson doing it. Not to mention that we don't have the facilities or personnel to support it, and Leitchfield certainly couldn't support a large event with a lot of teams coming to town. And if a situation were to arise where some teams needed lodging, our two small hotels couldn't provide for more than a few teams.

But, I do think with the State Tournament moving from Louisville to Lexington soon, I would love to see KAAC to put an event in Bowling Green or a similar location to help balance things out geographically.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

Good point Nick, but I still believe it is a possibility.
I would love to see a statewide JV Quiz bowl tournament take place in Kentucky this year.
Last edited by Scott on Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

As long as nobody is cheating, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a high school being the site for any kind of state championship. Missouri's JV state is held at Marshall High School, and Dorman and Brindlee Mountain I know have both run their state's NAQT championships before. Obviously getting facilities is a different matter, but I don't think that first criteria should really be discussed seriously if there's a good host school that happens to not be a college.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Andy Lyon »

soaringeagle22 wrote:So what's the situation on coaching changes? Does anyone know what Russell is doing in regards to their coaching situation? Are there other schools seeing staff changes this year?
I can provide you with an extremely detailed answer=P

Mr. Kirk Barnett is going to be the head coach. He will be the overall head, quick recall head, and will also be doing FPS. Our assistant coach, who will also coach JV is Lt. Col. John Burgess, who was with our team for many years and he has come out of retirement to help
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

^Those are good choices for Russell, I think they'll be strong again this year. BTW, Grayson's coaching staff has changed with Mrs. Sharon Sloan taking over as head coach. Other than that, most of the same people are involved with the program as last year, although Mrs. Blain is taking a more active/official role and I've graduated but will still be around helping out when I can.

Anyway, school starts back this week in some places (Grayson County among them), so that means the first organized competitions are roughly a month away. Anyone got predictions for how their fall leagues play out?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Huang »

soaringeagle22 wrote:^Those are good choices for Russell, I think they'll be strong again this year. BTW, Grayson's coaching staff has changed with Mrs. Sharon Sloan taking over as head coach. Other than that, most of the same people are involved with the program as last year, although Mrs. Blain is taking a more active/official role and I've graduated but will still be around helping out when I can.

Anyway, school starts back this week in some places (Grayson County among them), so that means the first organized competitions are roughly a month away. Anyone got predictions for how their fall leagues play out?
Not sure about leagues, but teams should travel to Danville's first tournament on September 12th.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

Grayson is going to the Danville, Ezell Harding, U of L, and Dunbar this fall.

As for the leagues, I believe our's will be very competitive.

I am glad that the PAA is shifting towards more pyramidal questions.
If I had guess, as far as predictions go, I would say:

1st and 2nd: Madisonville and Grayson
(Marshall would probably fall between these two levels if there join.)
3rd and 4th: Apollo and Owensboro
5th and 6th: Daviess and Henderson
7th: Owensboro Catholic
I really do not see any other teams in this league being competitive.

The SCKAC will probably not be quite as competitive.
I'd guess the top teams in it to finish something like this:

1st: Grayson
2nd: Edmonson
3rd: Greenwood
I'm not how things will fall after this.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by FCPanther »

Fleming County will be attending the U of L tournament and is planning making trips to Grayson County and Vanderbilt (depending on date and funds). We'd like to get to Danville and Dunbar but personal committments make those two days unworkable. In January we will again host our annual quick recall tournament, and would like to add another event sometime after Christmas (perhaps U of L). We are also trying to set up some evening scrimmage matches with schools that are in reasonable driving distance, perhaps doubling heading with another team from our league.

As for our league (Limestone Academic League), we're currently going through a bit of a transition having lost a team and trying to restructure some things schedule and fee wise (lots of boring details).

We will still be using KAAC questions in LAL, and it looks to be fairly competitive.

Fleming (3), Bath(4), Lewis(2), and Mason(2) Counties all return multiple starters off of teams that were competive beyond our region last year. St. Patrick and Montgomery Co. also look to be young, but capable. Bracken Co. and Nicholas Co. seem to be rebuilding, but should be capable of the occassional upset.

Last year several teams from Limestone League, and a few other schools in our region (notably Rowan Co. and Clark Co.) were able to schedule a round robin event late in the fall as a bit of a local tournament. We hope to do that again as well.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by maged »

My rankings for ky are
1st Dunbar- they're one of the best teams in the nation
2nd Manual- Should be good they only lose Ramapriya
3rd Johnson Central havent seen them play, but they won state quick recall
4th Russell they're one of the best teams i've played against in NAQT
5th Pikeville
6th MNH- Aaron is really good
7th Adair
8th Grayson County- im pretty sure they lost their best player, but i heard they had a lot of people at milligan
9th Ballard- We return two starters from our 7-5 team in NAQT and we had two good players on our team that went 3-7
10th Danville

We are planning to attend Ezell Harding, U of L or Vandy, Dunbar, Rowdy Raider or Chatahoochee.
Last edited by maged on Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

Those look like very accurate predictions.

As for our situation:
Our head coach has resigned and been replaced with three new coaches.

We lost Nick (45 ppg).
He was a very strong player, and losing him will hurt us.

We keep me (30 ppg).
I was in room 2 at Milligan.

We keep Julie (10 ppg).
She was in room 4 at Milligan.

We keep Cole (10 ppg).
He was in room 5 at Milligan.

Jason and Elizabeth also performed rather well at ACE.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Kahloon »

maged wrote:My rankings for ky are:
...
3rd Johnson Central havent seen them play, but they won state
Dunbar won both KAAC and NAQT state championships this year?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

I guess he was referring to quick recall.
However, the quick recall is not an accurate test of knowledge due to its high dependence on speed.
I think the overall Governor's Cup title is much more significant.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Kahloon »

Maybe, but Henry Clay, not Johnson County, won quick recall at the state level this year.
EDIT: My bad, Johnson did win.
Last edited by Kahloon on Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Huang »

Kahloon wrote:Maybe, but Henry Clay, not Johnson County, won quick recall at the state level this year.
No, Johnson Central won against Dunbar.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

grayson77 wrote:I guess he was referring to quick recall.
However, the quick recall is not an accurate test of knowledge due to its high dependence on speed.
I think the overall Governor's Cup title is much more significant.

It certainly does have too much of a speed factor, but it's a WHOLE lot better than it was when I was a freshman.

As for the rankings, that seems like it's fairly accurate. Grayson is working to earn that top ten spot this year, and I think Cole should replace my production. He's about as good at Social Studies as I am, but didn't buzz in a lot last year when he was confident that I knew it. Whether they finish that high or not depends solely on if they continue to work hard.

Edit for added quote
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Beastman »

Those rankings are pretty good looking to me. I'm not sure why Ballard is below us, since they beat us at NAQT State, but I won't ask questions. I'd probably put Russell above Johnson Central as far as quizbowl in general because Russell is pretty damn good at both quick recall and quizbowl pyramidal stuff. And this year hopefully with me and Scott, Grayson will light up State a little. ;-). I'm interested to see how us playing MadNoHo works out this year. It should be exciting.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

My guess with MVNH is that they will be better in social studies and we will be better in A/H.
The other subjects should be very close.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by HarvardHillBilly »

Pikeville plans to attend tournaments at Danville (hopefully!!), Vanderbilt or U of L, and Brookwood. We wanted to attend the Dunbar Tournament but most of our team will be taking the ACT that day.

As far as contenders are concerned, I would rank as follows:

Johnson Central (they return all their top players from last year)
Dunbar
duPont Manual (they should be pretty awesome this season)
Russell
Danville
Madisonville NH
Adair
Grayson

We hope to be competitive but we lost two valuable starters - Max Morley and Thomas Browning. Hopefully, Emily and Salman, as well as some others, can step up and help the team. Our first competition is tomorrow so we will get an early perspective on where we stand.

Good luck to everyone this year!!
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

Does anyone know any information about the Hart County tournament?
Grayson would like to attend if possible.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

Scott, here's the e-mail addresses for the two coaches listed as contacts for Hart County on the SCKAC website. Hope it helps:

[email protected]

[email protected]
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

I will have Mrs. Blain contact them tomorrow.
I think it would be a good chance to play against other great teams on quick recall, other than those in PAA.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by FCPanther »

Any word on results from Danville?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Kouign Amann »

Hey Kentucky people,

I was wondering if someone here could give me a basic description of the Governor's Cup format/rules or provide a link to such information. We received an 8th grade transfer from Kentucky this year who said he had played the format in his earlier middle school years, and I would like to be familiar with the format to ease his transition to the mACF format that so dominates DC-area competition.

Thanks.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Huang »

Prof.Whoopie wrote:Hey Kentucky people,

I was wondering if someone here could give me a basic description of the Governor's Cup format/rules or provide a link to such information. We received an 8th grade transfer from Kentucky this year who said he had played the format in his earlier middle school years, and I would like to be familiar with the format to ease his transition to the mACF format that so dominates DC-area competition.

Thanks.
http://www.kaac.com/govcup/index.html
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Kouign Amann »

Thanks dude.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by CoolBuzzerHandLuke »

J C Bennett wrote: To clear up any uncertainty, I'd like to make it clear that KAAC recognizes the value of multiple clues in descending order of difficulty. I'll avoid using the P-word, and another debate, out of deference to those who believe a good question must be 5-7 lines or more.

This is a fairly new thing for us. Like most quiz competitions years ago, our first questions were one-line buzzer races. The good folks at PACE have been very helpful in helping us teach writers the concepts behind a good question.

The best way to describe us now is "in transition." I believe it best for our students and coaches not to make an immediate, radical shift, but to advance steadily toward questions that more effectively measure in-depth knowledge. Those familiar with the breadth and scope of Kentucky academic competitions should understand the reasons behind this view. We have to overcome organizational inertia and other factors to get where we want to be, and re-train scores of writers and editors to look for more than just a correct answer and good grammar.

We'd welcome your help. We're always looking for effective, dependable writers and editors.
Could I write questions as a sophomore player? I know the p-word and am very good at writing questions, including for IRC games and for a house-written tournament for Manual. Here is my resume.

5th Grade, 1st Social Studies, 1st Art & Humanities, 1st Quick Recall (Team Captain of Bowen)
6th Grade, 1st Social Studies (District and Regionals), 1st Arts & Humanities (District), could not compete at State due to school change
7th Grade, 1st Social Studies (District and Regionals) top 30 State, 2nd District and 4th Regionals (Team Captain with a new small, private school team at Walden)
8th Grade, 1st Social Studies (District and Regionals) 5th State, Champion Kentucky Derby Festival (Social Studies expert for Noe)
9th Grade- Number 1 Freshman Nationals at the NAQT High School National Championship Tournament (HSNCT), A Team (occasionally) for Manual, Champion Team for the Kentucky Derby Festival
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by kanye4president »

Alpharetta High School would love to have some Kentucky teams at its inaugural JV tournament on October 31st. It will be played on the fall Novice Set
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by dbarman »

Has anyone heard anything about how Kentucky will select its HSAPQ All-Star team?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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dbarman wrote:Has anyone heard anything about how Kentucky will select its HSAPQ All-Star team?
I'm not sure. HSAPQ indicated that groups of players could apply directly to HSAPQ, so while it might be that KAAC will select an all-star team from across the state, it's possible another group could apply and get selected instead.

On a slightly related note, Governor's Cup is introducing All-District, All-Region, and All-State teams this year from what I understand. I imagine they'll be selected like Basketball where at the end of the tournament there is some vote, although I think students vote for these teams.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Scott »

That's somewhat interesting and surprising.
Where did you here about that?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Huang »

soaringeagle22 wrote:
dbarman wrote:Has anyone heard anything about how Kentucky will select its HSAPQ All-Star team?
I'm not sure. HSAPQ indicated that groups of players could apply directly to HSAPQ, so while it might be that KAAC will select an all-star team from across the state, it's possible another group could apply and get selected instead.
It seems like a questionable approach though. Most schools unfortunately are unaware of pyramidal questions or refuse to play pyramidal questions. I don't believe using KAAC results to determine an "all-star" team would necessarily produce Kentucky's best team at HSAPQ's tournament. Although, it really doesn't matter that much. Since even with Kentucky's best quizbowl players, Kentucky won't be winning against top tier regions like DC, Maryland, and Virginia any time in the near future.

Edit: I'm assuming most players/coaches/officials will be heavily relying on the state test when voting for who to be on the team
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

grayson77 wrote:That's somewhat interesting and surprising.
Where did you here about that?
I saw it on the KAAC website:

http://kaac.com/news/09-09news.pdf
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by ericblair »

Huang wrote:
soaringeagle22 wrote:
dbarman wrote:Has anyone heard anything about how Kentucky will select its HSAPQ All-Star team?
I'm not sure. HSAPQ indicated that groups of players could apply directly to HSAPQ, so while it might be that KAAC will select an all-star team from across the state, it's possible another group could apply and get selected instead.
It seems like a questionable approach though. Most schools unfortunately are unaware of pyramidal questions or refuse to play pyramidal questions. I don't believe using KAAC results to determine an "all-star" team would necessarily produce Kentucky's best team at HSAPQ's tournament. Although, it really doesn't matter that much. Since even with Kentucky's best quizbowl players, Kentucky won't be winning against top tier regions like DC, Maryland, and Virginia any time in the near future.

Edit: I'm assuming most players/coaches/officials will be heavily relying on the state test when voting for who to be on the team
I've been out of the loop with HS quizbowl/quick recall/what-have-you. HSAPQ selects an all-star team, but for what reason? Are they now hosting a national tournament? If so, then they could use their selection process to cater to their tournament while KAAC can continue with their selection to send to the Panasonic Academic Challenge, IF the PAC even exists today. Again, very out of the loop. Clarification would be nice.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

ericblair wrote:
Huang wrote:
soaringeagle22 wrote:
dbarman wrote:Has anyone heard anything about how Kentucky will select its HSAPQ All-Star team?
I'm not sure. HSAPQ indicated that groups of players could apply directly to HSAPQ, so while it might be that KAAC will select an all-star team from across the state, it's possible another group could apply and get selected instead.
It seems like a questionable approach though. Most schools unfortunately are unaware of pyramidal questions or refuse to play pyramidal questions. I don't believe using KAAC results to determine an "all-star" team would necessarily produce Kentucky's best team at HSAPQ's tournament. Although, it really doesn't matter that much. Since even with Kentucky's best quizbowl players, Kentucky won't be winning against top tier regions like DC, Maryland, and Virginia any time in the near future.

Edit: I'm assuming most players/coaches/officials will be heavily relying on the state test when voting for who to be on the team
I've been out of the loop with HS quizbowl/quick recall/what-have-you. HSAPQ selects an all-star team, but for what reason? Are they now hosting a national tournament? If so, then they could use their selection process to cater to their tournament while KAAC can continue with their selection to send to the Panasonic Academic Challenge, IF the PAC even exists today. Again, very out of the loop. Clarification would be nice.
'Kay.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=7719
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by ericblair »

Excellent! Thanks for the link. Seems like it will be a great tournament. And you guys are right, Governor's Cup may not be the BEST indicator necessarily for choosing an all-star team to compete in this new national all-star tournament because of the difference in styles; however, I can't imagine that the two selections will differ so much in the end. Since my days and what I have seen in recent years, the best quiz bowl players from KY tend to play well on quick recall questions.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by dbarman »

ericblair wrote:Excellent! Thanks for the link. Seems like it will be a great tournament. And you guys are right, Governor's Cup may not be the BEST indicator necessarily for choosing an all-star team to compete in this new national all-star tournament because of the difference in styles; however, I can't imagine that the two selections will differ so much in the end. Since my days and what I have seen in recent years, the best quiz bowl players from KY tend to play well on quick recall questions.
I tend to disagree. I would venture to say that few, if any, of the national contenders (State College, Maggie Walker) would be able to beat the best quick recall teams (Johnson County, Pikeville) on quick recall questions.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by TheKingInYellow »

We repeatedly get beaten by noted powerhouse Connestoga Valley at our state's "championship"
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Huang »

dbarman wrote:
ericblair wrote:Excellent! Thanks for the link. Seems like it will be a great tournament. And you guys are right, Governor's Cup may not be the BEST indicator necessarily for choosing an all-star team to compete in this new national all-star tournament because of the difference in styles; however, I can't imagine that the two selections will differ so much in the end. Since my days and what I have seen in recent years, the best quiz bowl players from KY tend to play well on quick recall questions.
I tend to disagree. I would venture to say that few, if any, of the national contenders (State College, Maggie Walker) would be able to beat the best quick recall teams (Johnson County, Pikeville) on quick recall questions.
Seconded. I'll add that Christoph, David, Graham, Greg, Monica, Sarah, and Tommy would probably leave the room enraged after hearing 3 questions of quick recall.

Edit: Corrected a name just for State College
Last edited by Huang on Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by at your pleasure »

By the way, do they at least give you a line or two to lateral the question or is it pure, utter, reflexes?
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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Doink the Clown wrote:By the way, do they at least give you a line or two to lateral the question or is it pure, utter, reflexes?
It's quite a bit better than it used to be, I've seen some questions in the past couple years that were 4 or 5 lines and written fairly well. But the traditional quick recall style questions (still used by a lot of leagues and tourneys in KY by the way) were used up until about my sophomore year. They were usually 1-2 lines but really the only part that mattered was the buzz words. It'd be something like:

Moderator: "blah, blah, blah, 3rd President"--BUZZ
Spotter: "Grayson, Nick"
Me: "Thomas Jefferson"

Also, last year in a quick recall league game we had the following question:

"How many years are in a millennium?"
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by TheKingInYellow »

Huang wrote:
Seconded. I'll add that Christopher, David, Graham, Greg, Monica, Sarah, and Tommy would probably leave the room enraged after hearing 3 questions of quick recall.
I hate to go to far of topic, but Christoph has asked me to correct the mistake so frequently made with his name. There is no one named Christopher on any SC team
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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ericblair wrote:the best quiz bowl players from KY tend to play well on quick recall questions.
As you can see I only referred to Kentucky. I will further clarify.
I use KY as an exceptional case because the best quizbowlers in the Bluegrass State are normally weened on and very accustomed to quick recall (and very good at it), whereas teams from other states play very little, if ever, in the quick recall format. I think that is why some of the greatest quiz bowl teams in the country can be beaten by less knowledgeable teams in quick recall--because of lack of experience, and probably, lack of enthusiasm (neither of which I can blame). But because the most knowledgeable Kentucky players usually perform very well in both formats, the two different methods for choosing an all-star team (one by quick recall and one by pyramidal questions) will heed a very similar if not identical team.

One way in which this is often not true is with a good quick recall math computational player. I have seen super solid math guys and gals in quick recall who were frankly useless at quiz bowl tournaments. And this is what could cause the slight difference in the selection processes. I am not, by the way, suggesting that one selection process overtake the other simply because of the possibility of this recurring phenomenon.

Edit: Further support for the thing about good KY quizbowlers being good at quick recall--Below are links to the results of a quiz bowl tournament in which various KY teams participated and the result of the state quick recall tournament. Looking at these one notices that the best KY quiz bowl teams according to the stats from Vanderbilt ABC XXXVI (Dunbar A, Dunbar B, Johnson Central A, Pikeville A, Russell) likewise secured the top spots in the state quick recall tournament in the same school year. This claim, of course, assumes that the teams did not change drastically, which I imagine not to be the case.

Vanderbilt ABC XXXVI: http://studentorgs.vanderbilt.edu/colle ... dings.html

2009 Governor's Cup State Quick Recall: http://www.kaac.com/govcup/index.html
Last edited by ericblair on Mon Oct 05, 2009 6:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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Well, one way to test Eric Blair's theory that Kentucky is a peculiar case would be to use quick recall to create one top 50 players list, create another top 50 players list using pyramidal questions(with the stipulation that the HSAPQ team would be based on the pyramidal list) and see how similar or dissimilar they are. However, I suspect strongly that the lists will be much more dissimilar than similar.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

Post by Rococo A Go Go »

Eric Blair isn't far off here, there is some correlation between the top teams and players in quick recall and KY quizbowl. But there is also still a significant difference, as in that some players who are good at quizbowl aren't neccessarily as good at quick recall, and vice versa.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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Doink the Clown wrote:Well, one way to test Eric Blair's theory that Kentucky is a peculiar case would be to use quick recall to create one top 50 players list, create another top 50 players list using pyramidal questions(with the stipulation that the HSAPQ team would be based on the pyramidal list) and see how similar or dissimilar they are. However, I suspect strongly that the lists will be much more dissimilar than similar.
I think you are right in that a list of the top 50 in both formats would prove quite dissimilar on the whole. But I think most of this would occur mainly in the bottom 35, because with lower tier players who perhaps don't take either of the games seriously may prove extensively better in one or the other. This bottom tier, however, doesn't matter for an all-star selection process (which is why we are discussing this). An all-star selection would likely take the top 6 to 8, the most dedicated and knowledgeable players who almost always perform well in both quick recall and quiz bowl. In that case the outcome would prove much more similar than with the bottom 35 or so. Sure, it's very possible that number one in quick recall might be number 4 in quiz bowl, and number six in quick recall be number two in quiz bowl, but in the end a similar team will emerge from both tests. I reiterate, though, that because of the freak chance that someone be the fiftieth best player in the state in quick recall and one of the top eight in quiz bowl, the two all-star selection processes should be used for their respective purposes.
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Re: Kentucky 09-10

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I believe that I and Grayson as a whole are about equal in both formats.
However, I think that we will become better at quiz bowl at a faster rate in the upcoming years.
While some KY teams are completely different in the two formats, if cannot be denied that the same teams are good at both.
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