ACE Camp

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ACE Camp

Post by ClemsonQB »

I have a few questions to ask about this year's ACE Camp:

How did everyone at SEMO like the Wild Man Tournament questions and the same for the other night tournament written by Nick Clusserath and I (One of the team tournaments 20/20 with two part bonuses)? DO NOT discuss specific questions as the questions will be used at later camps.

Who placed in the subject area tournaments at SEMO?

What are everyone’s predictions for the subject area tournaments at the other camps?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by akinney »

Every single aspect of the tournaments was great. I especially enjoyed the Wild Man and College-Style tournaments.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by harpersferry »

Wild Man? Explain please.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by ClemsonQB »

pasedpawn wrote:Wild Man? Explain please.
When asked to write the questions, I was told it was a "Wild Man Tournament", a singles tournament consisting of four games of 38 one-liners. I don't come up with the names or the ideas, I just write.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

Last year the Wild Man tournament at MSM consisted of individual competition with about 8 people in each room, playing on questions the assorted people in charge had found in file cabinets somewhere. A lot of them were pretty bad. The idea was to have a good time the first night, and I think it may also have influenced the first practice room assignments. They may have just used the tests for that; I'm not sure. I'm glad to hear the question quality has been improved though, since I'm heading off to Milligan next week.

BTW does anyone know what schools will be represented at Milligan? I figure most of the people I know will be at MSM if they're going to camp, so I'm curious.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by wowitsquinthaha »

Wild Man?!! I was in that once...
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

At least 2 or 3 members of team Caesar Rodney will be attending for the first time ever. Introduce yourself to Trey and Kelly (and possibly more...).
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by hookemhorns10 »

A handful of Georgia schools (Brookwood, Chattahoochee, Walton) will be attending Milligan along with Dorman.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jrbarry »

Raceland-Worthington, Dunbar, Paul Blazer, Daviess County, Grayson County, Woodford County, duPont Manual, JOhnson Central, Pikeville, Russell, Marion County in KY

Ezell Harding, KNoxville West, Lincoln County, Christian Academy of Knoxville, MLK in TN

Walton, NOrcross, Brookwood, Chattahoochee, Lakeside, Eastside, Westminster in GA

Dorman, James Island, Southside in SC

Robinson in NC

Latin School of Chicago and Wheaton Warrenville South in IL

Ripley in WV

Minden in LA

Copley in OH

126 student campers plus coaches at MIlligan College starting on TUesday.

Still openings if anyone wants to come at the last minute. At Mount St Mary's University in MD also, July 20-24.

Contact J.R. Barry at [email protected]
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by wexs883198215 »

sigh... my teammate decided not to attend MSM (despite assuring me he would =_="), and I am left rideless on the way home!
my parents planned to vacation while i was gone and have already made arrangements

so, are there any kind folks willing to drive a kid from MSM to rockville?
thanks!
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jackatthedisco »

I will be attending Milligan in a few days.
(First ACE camp. Very excited!)

I have a question, though:

1.) How do the tournaments at the end of the camp work? I don't see how it could be very big if there are no majors anymore.

Thanks.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

jackatthedisco wrote:I will be attending Milligan in a few days.
(First ACE camp. Very excited!)

I have a question, though:

1.) How do the tournaments at the end of the camp work? I don't see how it could be very big if there are no majors anymore.

Thanks.
The way they did it at MSM last year (the camp at which this year's format was tested) was to have each camper write the tournament he/she wanted to compete in on the camp test before turning it in. You can compete in any one of them, regardless of which classes you're taking.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Coach K »

MLWGS-Gir wrote:
jackatthedisco wrote:I will be attending Milligan in a few days.
(First ACE camp. Very excited!)

I have a question, though:

1.) How do the tournaments at the end of the camp work? I don't see how it could be very big if there are no majors anymore.

Thanks.
The way they did it at MSM last year (the camp at which this year's format was tested) was to have each camper write the tournament he/she wanted to compete in on the camp test before turning it in. You can compete in any one of them, regardless of which classes you're taking.
That's how they handled it at SEMO this year. They waited until Wednesday to have the campers pick though.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jrbarry »

1. Camp course selection process is as follows: each camper gets a course selection form as he/she checks in on Tuesday. We explain our courses at Orientation and players may then hand in their forms, until the Wild Man Tournament starts at 7pm. Players pick up their forms after the championship match of the Wild Man Tournament that night and see what they ended up with. 95% of SEMO campers got exactly what they requested. Some sections of some courses may not "make" so to speak. We consolidated two sections at the SEMO camp which caused a few campers to get their second choice for a class.

2. Each camper will have to declare which subject matter contest they will participate in on Friday morning. The tournaments will be played on Saturday afternoon, the last events of camp. The choice of contests is not related ot the classes a camper takes.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by AdamL »

How are the preliminary rounds for the subject tournaments set up now (as in, which students are in which rooms)? In past years they were based on how well students had been doing on their quizzes, but now that the classes and subject tournament choice don't necessarily match up, is that still going to be used?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by wexs883198215 »

now altering plea to drop off at near bus stop 10 minutes away!
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by ClemsonQB »

Milligan Update

First night stuff...
The camp test results were as following:
4th Todd Faulkenberry (Dorman)
3rd Freddy Deangelis (Dorman)
2nd Arvind Sekar (Brookwood)
1st Vamsi Tata (Brookwood)

Congradulations to those and also congradulations to the following who placed in the Wild Man Tournament.
3rd Rafe Haddox of James Island
2nd Freddy
1st Todd
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by ClemsonQB »

It seems that a Todd led team edged out a Freddy led team to win tonight's night tournament at Milligan as well.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by theattachment »

A Dorman team beating a Dorman team? Unpossible!

I'm sorry, I couldn't resist.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by BGSO »

Do you know the scores that they got on the camp test?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jrbarry »

Highest camp test score at MIlligan was 59. Highest at SEMO was 47. (Both are out of a total of 70 questions.) 19 campers at Milligan scored higher than 47 on that test.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by akinney »

I believe the highest at SEMO was in fact a 49.

SEMO will take on Milligan any day!
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by harpersferry »

akinney wrote:SEMO will take on Milligan any day!
Not so sure...

It seems that the ACE camps tend to reflect the general trend of the country, and as such the eastern one tends to draw better competition.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by AdamL »

Another Milligan update:

Tonight (2nd night tourney) the team led by Arvind defeated the team led by Todd 355-235. Two appearances in a row by Todd. three-peat...?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Siverus Snape »

jrbarry wrote:Highest camp test score at MIlligan was 59. Highest at SEMO was 47. (Both are out of a total of 70 questions.) 19 campers at Milligan scored higher than 47 on that test.
Way to take the air out of Illinois' collective balloon.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by AdamL »

Todd won the literature tournament, Freddy won the science, and Wes (from Chattahoochee) won the social studies. Congrats to all

I didn't find out who won the third night's tournament but I know Todd didn't achieve his three-peat, going 2-1 after losing to Freddy's team on the last question.

As to the test scores, maybe the high score at SEMO was 49, not 47 (I don't know this though, I'm definitely not speaking for Mr. Barry) but I know that one of my teammates got a 49 and was in practice room 3 on the first day, which seems to indicate that maybe the number 19 is still correct for "how many got higher than the highest at SEMO".
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Sonic the Hedgehog and the Fox »

AdamL wrote:
I didn't find out who won the third night's tournament but I know Todd didn't achieve his three-peat, going 2-1 after losing to Freddy's team on the last question.
Adam- it was my esteemed colleague, classmate, teammate, and third cousin Travis Pritchett who beat Freddy's team in the finals of Friday's Upper Tournament. Even though he mispronounced the name answer redacted, which he just told me he's been saying since he learned of <certain composition> in the 9th grade. Good thing I've been getting <answer> over him for three years now.

EDIT: Sorry about that. Lapse in my thought, and I edited out clues. Thanks to George later in the thread for poitning out my error.
Last edited by Sonic the Hedgehog and the Fox on Sun Jul 13, 2008 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Xerxes »

quizbowlabc wrote:Milligan Update

First night stuff...
The camp test results were as following:
4th Todd Faulkenberry (Dorman)
EDIT: It was actually a tie between me, him, and Austin Wang.

ACE camp was great. The practice was great. The tournaments were great. The staff-student game was rigged. Too bad I had to miss the finals...but my ride (who was extremely considerate to drive me down to Georgia for free) was visiting Alaska the next day and obviously wanted to be home earlier...

I would like to thank the camp directors and staffers for putting this on every year. It's one of the best opportunities to learn quizbowl material and play top-competition anywhere.
Last edited by Xerxes on Mon Jul 14, 2008 2:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: ACE Camp

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Xerxes wrote: The staff-student game was rigged.
The students were originally told to find a source of questions. I volunteered to use my computer (and internet access) to help the guys out, and while I was in the process of this one teacher requested community college difficulty and another asked me to keep answer selection to stuff campers could learn from. After mashing three rounds together and using up that night's study time, I achieved this. Apparently there was a lack of communication resulting in the staff's finding of questions that would result in learning, not realizing that the packet the students provided would do this. Exactly who rigged the game is debatable, as one member of the staff team told me that it was not their original intention to cheat but rather to facilitate learning. Which I understand. Multiple folders were handed to the reader by someone I'm fairly certain wasn't on the staff team, so it's not clear who was responsible for the cheating. The mandatory inclusion of 5 students who weren't part of the group who challenged the staff was also a bit absurd, but so it goes. I believe there may have been some revenge from a game that took place last year involved. Anyway, I just wanted to get the (somewhat) full story out there for people to evaluate as they will.

Pretty much everything but this was awesome about camp, though. The one thing I really found ridiculous was the scheduling of the game to get us into the auditorium for a recruitment session for Milligan College that delayed the game and caused it to cut into our dinner. While I understand that a school would want to reach out to people who are supposed to be smart, I think they really wasted their time. I'd have preferred that those of us who are Jews/Hindus/Muslims/atheists/agnostics/other non-Christians had known about this and not been effectively tricked into wasting our time attempting to listen politely to a Christian school's propaganda.

My classes were great, and I found the practices and tournaments to be great experiences (although not so much the ridiculously math heavy packets used the final night, but I understand that some of the teams there are accustomed to formats with lots of it). We didn't have any recruitment-type stuff at MSM last year, so I'm guessing that may have been a part of Milligan's conditions for letting ACE use the campus. My intention is not to be negative about ACE, as I think I really benefitted from this camp, but rather to explain the only problems I had with it, both of which I forgot to include on the feedback sheet.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by cdcarter »

That last post was kind of confusing. Could you explain it a little more clearly for those of us not at the camp, Sarah?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

cdcarter wrote:That last post was kind of confusing. Could you explain it a little more clearly for those of us not at the camp, Sarah?
Some things I think may not have been as clear as possible: 6 guys challenged the teachers to a game, the 11 that ended up playing were the people who had either been in Room 1 all week or had perfect quiz scores. These people had to play whether they wanted to or not as substitutions were mandatory after every 5 questions. The set that ended up being used wasn't as good (IMO) as the one I put together (it included several one-line geo questions, among other things) and it was specifically tailored to things the staff had taught, although I'm not certain who wrote them. I heard from some people who went to a different camp than me last year that a teacher-student game was held in which the teachers lost by 10 points, on the last question. The students who made the challenge wanted to play that night, and Mr. Barry accepted the challenge on the condition that the game occur at 4 o'clock the next day. When we arrived to watch the game, we instead were handed Milligan info forms and got to sit through a 20 minute presentation that many of the people involved had no interest in at all.

I was trying to be clear; I may have rambled a bit. I'm quite prone to that, especially when I'm tired. What I was definitely trying to express clearly was that I was not trying to give a negative impression of camp, as my overall experience was great. I hope that, at least, was clear. If anything else is confusing, please ask specifically as it probably made sense to me at the time.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jrbarry »

SaraH:

I am glad you found the camp helpful.

The only time to play that unscheduled game between students and staff was at 4pm on Friday since the "challenge" was not issued until late Thursday night. We could not play after the nightly tournaments as the buildings were locked every night at 10pm and our activities ended around 9:40. No camper was forced to come to that 4pm MC recruiting pitch and only about half our campers were there at 4pm since it was a voluntary thing. I hope you were not really offended by a college's pitch and yes, it was a condition we agreed to as we do every year at most places we have our camps. (Mount St Mary's did their pitch on day one at camp orientation.)

I am the one who wanted any contest at ACE to have ACE-worthy questions which is why they used old ACE subject matter tournament questions from three folders. I also stipulated that the self-appointed "6" (2 of them were players off my own team) who issued the challenge not be the team, but, rather, the student team come from the players who had been in the top room every time and also the players who had perfect quiz grades. (Most of the 6 were part of the 11 players who comprised that student team.)

As I was working, I did not see the game. BUt, it was all in jest and NOT a serious game in sense of that word. I certainly hope no one" got in an uproar" over that rather silly exercise.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Sir Thopas »

jrbarry wrote:I am the one who wanted any contest at ACE to have ACE-worthy questions which is why they used old ACE subject matter tournament questions from three folders. I also stipulated that the self-appointed "6" (2 of them were players off my own team) who issued the challenge not be the team, but, rather, the student team come from the players who had been in the top room every time and also the players who had perfect quiz grades. (Most of the 6 were part of the 11 players who comprised that student team.)
Well, it sure seems like you spent a lot of time making this game out to be exactly how you wanted it to be, changing the content and even the participants of the original challenge, which was surely meant to be fun. Also, how are college questions ACE-unworthy?
As I was working, I did not see the game. BUt, it was all in jest and NOT a serious game in sense of that word. I certainly hope no one" got in an uproar" over that rather silly exercise.
Oh wait, never mind. I guess all that effort you put into it to have it be as you wanted was totally irrelevant, because it was NOT a serious game! If it were so casual, why not just let the kids do what they'd planned and originally wanted?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Sonic the Hedgehog and the Fox »

I think the student-staff game discussion is a bit too heated. As one of the orchestrators of the affair, it WAS in jest, like Mr. Barry says, and wasn't meant to show superiority at all. In fact, I'm fairly certain it was supposed to be a carrying-on of the tradition of the Top 6's game against the staff from PC the year before, a game I (and Travis too) also took part in. Really, if it had been a serious game, I wouldn't have cut off a reader at the second word of a bonus (a masterful counterstroke on my part, if I do say so) . All in all, I had great fun with the game, and would like to see the old timers for a rematch any day. :razz:
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Down and out in Quintana Roo »

MLWGS-Gir wrote:The one thing I really found ridiculous was the scheduling of the game to get us into the auditorium for a recruitment session for Milligan College that delayed the game and caused it to cut into our dinner. While I understand that a school would want to reach out to people who are supposed to be smart, I think they really wasted their time. I'd have preferred that those of us who are Jews/Hindus/Muslims/atheists/agnostics/other non-Christians had known about this and not been effectively tricked into wasting our time attempting to listen politely to a Christian school's propaganda.
I really hope they don't try something stupid like this at Mt. St. Mary's because i'm going to have two very annoyed and angry kids who might just walk out of it.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Sarah, most of the time if you host something for high schoolers on a college campus you have to give the college permission to pitch itself. I mean, I don't understand what the huge deal is, because over the next couple of years you are going to be getting a lot of mail from said private, religious schools that presumably talk about the same stuff. I'm in the non-Christian religious boat you described, but I don't see why I have to make a big deal every time someone sends me a pamphlet about God or talks to me about going to their church.
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Re: ACE Camp

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I know for me and past competitions, I usually allow the admissions office an opportunity to recruit at high school events. While I don't always get the admissions office to do squat at Duke, Case was a bit more accommodating because they know they have a good group of students. They did help me with a lot of things early on in any competition that I was organizing, especially initial lists of feeder high schools. With smaller schools like the ones hosting these camps, I'm sure they would be ecstatic to talk about their college to a bunch of very bright students (as was the case when I ran Ohio Academic Decathlon at Hiram College).

Granted, a recruiting pitch should just be limited to a brief 5-10 minute talk to not derail a schedule, but I don't know if this student-teacher game was designed to be in that slot. But I'd just sit in and listen to my MP3 player...
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by sunh »

Caesar Rodney HS wrote:
MLWGS-Gir wrote:The one thing I really found ridiculous was the scheduling of the game to get us into the auditorium for a recruitment session for Milligan College that delayed the game and caused it to cut into our dinner. While I understand that a school would want to reach out to people who are supposed to be smart, I think they really wasted their time. I'd have preferred that those of us who are Jews/Hindus/Muslims/atheists/agnostics/other non-Christians had known about this and not been effectively tricked into wasting our time attempting to listen politely to a Christian school's propaganda.
I really hope they don't try something stupid like this at Mt. St. Mary's because i'm going to have two very annoyed and angry kids who might just walk out of it.
Wow your kids have sensitivity issues.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by AKKOLADE »

Deesy Does It wrote:Sarah, most of the time if you host something for high schoolers on a college campus you have to give the college permission to pitch itself. I mean, I don't understand what the huge deal is, because over the next couple of years you are going to be getting a lot of mail from said private, religious schools that presumably talk about the same stuff. I'm in the non-Christian religious boat you described, but I don't see why I have to make a big deal every time someone sends me a pamphlet about God or talks to me about going to their church.
Charlie's definitely right - as long as they didn't go into evangelizing or anything, sweet talking their school is often an expected part of hosting at a college or university. When I held tournaments at WV Wesleyan, I'd be able to score things like free breakfasts for the players that would normally have cost hundreds of dollars in exchange for the admissions office displaying school information in a prominent place and sometimes having a short "yay us" speech.

Now, if they started pushing their religion, that would be far more questionable as to if it's acceptable in my opinion.
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Blackboard Monitor Vimes
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

leftsaidfred wrote:
Deesy Does It wrote:Sarah, most of the time if you host something for high schoolers on a college campus you have to give the college permission to pitch itself. I mean, I don't understand what the huge deal is, because over the next couple of years you are going to be getting a lot of mail from said private, religious schools that presumably talk about the same stuff. I'm in the non-Christian religious boat you described, but I don't see why I have to make a big deal every time someone sends me a pamphlet about God or talks to me about going to their church.
Charlie's definitely right - as long as they didn't go into evangelizing or anything, sweet talking their school is often an expected part of hosting at a college or university. When I held tournaments at WV Wesleyan, I'd be able to score things like free breakfasts for the players that would normally have cost hundreds of dollars in exchange for the admissions office displaying school information in a prominent place and sometimes having a short "yay us" speech.

Now, if they started pushing their religion, that would be far more questionable as to if it's acceptable in my opinion.
Wow. People are thinking I was significantly more annoyed than I actually was. What I was really trying to say is that I didn't quite even see the point of them advertising to a group that clearly wasn't interested. It just seemed like a massive waste of time.
Sam (Sarah Angelo) Luongo,
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

RH_Factor wrote: Really, if it had been a serious game, I wouldn't have cut off a reader at the second word of a bonus (a masterful counterstroke on my part, if I do say so) .
That was hilarious. Really, I think I was probably only as annoyed as I was because two things that agitate me were consecutive: pointlessness and bad questions (no offense to whoever wrote them, but one-line toss-ups and practically toss-up-length bonuses are unnecessary, especially since it wouldn't have been hard to get good questions). I also think it would have been beneficial for some of the people who were there who don't play pyramidal questions often to see a good game played on good questions.
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President, PACE
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jrbarry »

Sarah is exactly right: that 5-to-7-minute pitch for the local college during that voluntary meeting at MC WAS a waste of time. I also suggested to the MC people that it might not be the best use of their time, but to no avail.

To be honest, Sarah, I had forgotten MC was supposed to come and make a pitch at 4pm on Friday. Whern I said to the group Thursday night that Friday at 4pm was the only time for any staff-student game, I simply did not remember that I had agreed to let MC come at that time and advertise.

ACE has had 31 camps now over 15 years. At only TWO camps have we ever had a staff-student game. It isn't an ACE tradition and was not included on our schedule. Two sources of questions were offered to me for that "game," but I decided to use questions ACE had used 5-8 years earlier in ACE-sponsored contests. That seemed the most appropriate thing to do at an ACE camp.

metsfan01: I had no idea where the questions Sarah offered were coming from. I was simply told they were off the internet.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by ClemsonQB »

RH_Factor wrote:MUSIC ANSWER
Do not talk about the specifics of questions as they will likely be used at MSM.
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Xerxes
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Xerxes »

My comment about the staff-student game being rigged was a joke. Everyone, including myself, had a good time. As has been said before, it wasn't meant to be taken that seriously.

EDIT:
One thing that did bother me a little: the questions written for the team tournament on the third night were distributed horribly. There was more science that literature and history combinded, and the computational math distribution was incredibly high.

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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Sonic the Hedgehog and the Fox »

AdamL wrote:Todd won the literature tournament, Freddy won the science, and Wes (from Chattahoochee) won the social studies. Congrats to all
(Why do I keep quoting this post?!)

Does anyone know who got place and show in the social studies tournament? I heard some secret, evil rumour that I placed third, but I left before the awards ceremony and I wouldn't know.

And, while we're at it, who got place and show in literature and science?
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by hookemhorns10 »

Purely from memory:

Social Studies:
1st - Wes Austin(Chattahoochee)
2nd - Brad Cantrell (Johnson Central)
3rd - Rafe Haddox! (James Island)

Literature:
1st - Todd Faulkenberry (Dorman)
2nd - Emily Thacker (Pikeville)
3rd - Jack (Pikeville)

Science:
1st - Freddy DeAngelis (Dorman)
2nd - Faiyad (Johnson Central)
3rd - Matt Brown (Brookwood)

As you can see, Rafe, you in fact did place third in the Social Studies competition. With your knowledge distribution, you probably could have placed as high or even higher in the other competitions as well. :razz:

p.s. - I was too hesitant to buzz in on Mourning Becomes Electra (which we went over for half of our American Drama class one day) even when I knew it cold because I had 3 negs. Turns out that I ended up negging out on the next to last question anyway haha.
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by Blackboard Monitor Vimes »

As someone who wrote the results down, I can verify Arvind's memory as correct. You need to work on your self-esteem, Rafe, you did well. If I remember correctly, the social science tournament was by far the closest (although the lit final would have been closer if Arvind hadn't negged out).
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by jackatthedisco »

Ah Milligan. Good times.
I will definitely miss it.
Kudos to the teachers/staff for an awesome job!
I was just happy to get out of the preliminary room with Todd Faulkenberry.

The Science final as epic. Freddy was tearing it up.

(ps: Faiyad's last name is Mannan, for future reference.)
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by chemqueen2 »

Science finals were incredibly epic. I was just happy to get out there. Two good kids in my room negged out. Then, I still interrupted three questions after my third neg. I got up there, only to be destroyed...
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Re: ACE Camp

Post by sunh »

I'm assuming the word epic in this context means total domination by one person.
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