Interest in an early season National quality tournament

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emactruman
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Interest in an early season National quality tournament

Post by emactruman »

How many teams would be interested in a invite only tournament that combined some of the best teams from the previous season in a early season tournament (sometime prior to Thanksgiving).

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Post by Gonzagapuma1 »

Where would it be?

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Post by Howard »

Considering the poster, I'm guessing somewhere in Michigan.
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Post by BobGHHS »

Wayne State?
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Post by emactruman »

Yes. I am still working out many details. This thread is just a recon mission.

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

lol @ like 40 proposed national tournaments at Wayne State in the past.
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Post by emactruman »

Do you know what it takes to run a tournament? I'm going to assume not or else you'd understand that sometimes things just don't work out.

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Post by DumbJaques »

Do you know what it takes to run a tournament? I'm going to assume not or else you'd understand that sometimes things just don't work out.
. . .

Actually I think Charlie Dees is running two tournaments this year. If Charlie Dees can manage not to screw something up, surely you can to?

EDIT:

Actually, after taking a look at your post history, "sometimes things just don't work out" doesn't quite cover it there, does it? Maybe you should stop making "would anyone like to come to this nebulous 'nationals' tournament at Wayne St." thread over and over again, waiting until it gets archived because it's been canceled/nobody cares, and repeating the process. It's kind of a joke.
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Post by NoahMinkCHS »

DumbJaques wrote:Actually I think Charlie Dees is running two tournaments this year. If Charlie Dees can manage not to screw something up, surely you can to?
Has Charlie run tournaments before, though? (I don't know and am honestly curious.)

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Kind of. I've helped run the JV and varsity tournaments that NKC ran last year. Basically my job was to direct teams around, write a lot of the questions, register everybody, and tell everybody what was going on since our coach can randomly disappear.
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Post by emactruman »

Allow me to explain myself a little further. I have noticed that most teams in the michigan area do not travel often to see teams from outside our own state and Ohio (DCC exluded). Likewise, it is to my understanding that there are few tournaments that have a national championship caliber field of teams early on. So I am trying to provide a forum for this. I am also trying to ensure that I do so to the best of my capabilities. I believe this is only the second of such post I have made. The last one was at the end of the year and was archived as were all of such threads. It's pretained to this season as was done to see what the interest level was from abroad. I figured that since it was posted late in the season not many people may have payed attention to it. As far as failed attempts, this is therefore still that initial attempt. Also, I am still trying to procure a suitable question set, which seems to be difficult to do for our area for the date we have targeted.

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Post by STPickrell »

emactruman wrote:Also, I am still trying to procure a suitable question set, which seems to be difficult to do for our area for the date we have targeted.
Kirk,

I can provide you some TU/bonus matches from my VHSL and MSHSAA sets. I will have some of these ready by 1 November.

The bonuses are all 4-parters though. They will not be as finely edited as NAQT, but will not be utter dreck, either. Teams from VA and Missouri could not attend of course.

I would only recommend this if you can't secure an NAQT set.

Just let me know what you're looking for in terms of distribution, etc. I can send you some samples and give pricing.

Shawn

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Teams for VA not competing kind of defeats the purpose of a "national" level tournament, at least the kind you seem to want.
Actually, aside from real nationals, I can't see any tournament very far out of DC as able to attract as strong a field as otherwise.
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Post by STPickrell »

Deesy Does It wrote:Teams for VA not competing kind of defeats the purpose of a "national" level tournament, at least the kind you seem to want.
Actually, aside from real nationals, I can't see any tournament very far out of DC as able to attract as strong a field as otherwise.
I can see him getting a decent field from Chicagoland, Ohio, Kentucky, Indiana, and Michigan, if he has a decent reputation and it is well-marketed and put on a good date.

TJ/Gov would be the only Virginia teams that would consider attending. I don't see teams at the Princess Anne/Cave Spring/George Mason level attending a regular tournament in MI.

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

The only point I'm trying to make is that if TJ and Gov don't go (especially the TJ-on-paper for this season) that significantly reduces it's "national"-ness. Especially since I don't get the vibe that many of those teams from DC would be very interested in going to Michigan over some local tournament.
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Post by emactruman »

The goal was to get TJ and Gov to come. The hope was to get 20 of the better teams in the nation as well as the top few from within Michigan and Ohio. So that teams could have a barometer so to speak.

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Post by DumbJaques »

The goal was to get TJ and Gov to come. The hope was to get 20 of the better teams in the nation as well as the top few from within Michigan and Ohio. So that teams could have a barometer so to speak.
Well, I think this is why this whole thread sounds so ludicrous to so many people. You have continually made this thread only to have it fizzle out for sometimes unexplained reasons. Teams that were looking for an early-season national quality tournament would probably want to buy tickets and make reservations sometime around right now, and that would be a pretty poor investment given this tournament's prior (and predictably, future) fate.

Also, Michigan is hardly a great place to have this kind of a tournament. I fail to see the logic in asking the ~15 top-class teams from the south, mid-atlantic, and northeast to come to Michigan for games against the ~5 top teams from Michigan, Minnesotta, and Illinois. Surely you understand why this doesn't make sense. Also, you posted on September 4 for a tournament you want teams to fly to that will take place before mid-November, then had the audacity to talk to someone else about demonstrating inexperience with hosting tournaments It's inconceivable more than 3 or 4 teams could get travel stuff together in that amount of time, and that's if anyone would be crazy enough to come to the tournament given the reasons I just mentioned.

That doesn't even take into account how much more ridiculous this thread got after VHSL became a potential question source at this "pre-nationals" event. Don't get me wrong, Shawn's stuff being used in Missouri is a victory for quizbowl in general, but I'd imagine he'd agree it's neither designed nor appropriate for a nationals-level tournament. In short, were I a coach not from Michigan I would find it impossible to take this thread seriously - you probably want to address some of the points I raised if you're serious about trying this.
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Post by STPickrell »

Hi Chris, I was the one who proposed using VHSL questions as Kirk had expressed concern with finding a source of questions. So I apologize for my role in this thread.

While my questions are not 100% 'inappropriate,' they are not 'ideal' for a pre-national tournament. (Hence the 'I would only recommend this if you can't secure an NAQT set' disclaimer.)

Come to think of it, regular IS is probably not appropriate for a 'pre-nationals' event either, no matter where it's held. Hopefully NAQT can begin to offer 'C' level sets for low-end college and high-end high school competitions.

I would recommend to Kirk that he organize regional tournaments before going for the 'big kahuna.'

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Post by DumbJaques »

Come to think of it, regular IS is probably not appropriate for a 'pre-nationals' event either, no matter where it's held.
Not to derail the thread, but I'm actually somewhat concerned about this too. It seems to me like 2-3 years ago, the later sets were certainly not inappropriate for nationals-level tournaments. I'm very interested to see how teams react to the set used at the Weekend of Quizbowl. . . I would think NAQT could produce at least one hs set that was noticeably harder than the others.
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Post by emactruman »

As stated before, this thread was a revisitation of a thread posted towards the end of last year. Contrary to many people's belief this has been in the works since April of last year. The last time (and only other time) that this was discussed there seemed to be no responses at all. So I had figured most people were to invovled with nationals and graduation to pay any attention. As for running regional tournaments. We ran one last season are intending to run another in March. Also, no offence, but never was the plan to use VHSL material for this tournament. It was jsut offered to me. The intent was to procure a set from PACE specifically for this tournament, that they could then offer, at their own freewill, to another event post tournament date.

Again, the September posting was a last ditch effort of sorts.

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Post by STPickrell »

I would focus on improving your March tournament to the point where it becomes a de facto pre-nationals. You may want to consider putting two divisions in place similar to the way Patriot Games was organized last year.

Another thing that works against you is that the center of QB power has shifted from Michigan to DC/VA. If you had proposed this in 2000 and had a good source of questions, you might have gotten a better turnout.

I cannot speak for PACE but if they can offer you a set then more power to them. They might be the source of 'C' level questions for high end high school and low end college teams. My offer of using VHSL questions was made only after you had expressed concern with securing a question set.

Good luck with your March tournament.

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Post by First Chairman »

Well... if you'd like to help out, we'd love to have you. :)
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Post by jrbarry »

Another thing that works against you is that the center of QB power has shifted from Michigan to DC/VA.

Wow. I didn't know that about Michigan. And what do you mean by "center of quiz bowl power?"

Just trying to learn.

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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

Thomas Jefferson, Richard Montgomery, Maggie Walker, Whitman, Gonzaga, Walter Johnson, Georgetown, not to mention Stuyvesant, Hunter, Wilmington Charter, and State College making frequent trips to DC certainly gives that assertion some credence.
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Post by emactruman »

Thanks for the advice. I may be still interested in purchasing some VHSL material for a much more localized tourney.

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