Florida 2007-08

[wd4gdz]

There aren't too many people on these boards from Florida, but here goes nothing.

Ransom Everglades is probably the best team in the state. Unfortunately, they are located way in the south, while most hs quizbowl occurs in the Panhandle region. Nevertheless, their team at HSNCT finished 6-4, and was comprised of all sophomores.

Pensacola is becoming a quizbowl factory, producing good teams every year. Unfortunately, it appears they are losing their two best players, but I think their coach can help them rebound.

Rickards and Eastside will also probably be good next year. Unfortunately, they don't really compete on the national level.

Any other comments?

[Byko]

I, for one, would simply love for there to be more tournaments in Florida. I know Florida State and UF run tournaments, and I know that more than 4 high school teams exist in the state. So why not have more tournaments hosted by high schools? I can provide questions--let me know if there's anything I can do to help create more of a circuit down there.

[hardeecoach]

I think academic compettion in Florida is slowly dying because, unfortunately, school districts are not concerned about academic excellence. It is simply not a priority. The FCAT ( our state test and the acompanying legislative mandates) and athletics (i.e. football) are.
Billy is correct- the only organized competition is in the Panhandle area , which mandates travel, which equates to funding. Our football team already ordered new uniforms and supplies- I saw the invoice on our fax machine and was astounded to see that the dollar amount was twice our annual budget. Quizbowl is not a spectator sport and therefore not an income generator.
I have seen good teams (Martin and Okeechobee) fold because they have not been able to find a coach. Indian River's coach retired this year after twenty years and there was doubt about finding a replacement. At my school, the football coach quit and the ensuing search for a new coach looked like the appointment of a new Pope. I have no doubt that if I retired tomorrow, that would be the end of the program at Hardee. Even if the JV coach took over, they couldn't find another JV coach to replace him. Nobody wants to have to fight for every little thing they need, whether it's funding, or recognition for their players. We have come a long way but the progress we have made is tenuous at best. It's very discouraging.

I don't think it's just Florida, either. I learned at PACE that TJ Governor's School has operated all this year without a coach. If national championship/ magnet schools are having the same problem-- what in the world is going on?

[Byko]

So the comments I'm hearing beg the question: what can be done to make quiz bowl at least a higher priority?

While I'm not particularly fond of the CAC concept of having all-county teams competing against each other at state, I do have one question: is there scholarship money for teams competing in that tournament? Would scholarship money, either on statewide or national levels, help to promote quiz bowl in underrepresented areas? Or is there something else that could be an effective hook? Maybe some of this discussion belongs in another forum, but I at least want to get some input from Floridians about this to start since it is such an underrepresented region.

I don't think it's just Florida, either. I learned at PACE that TJ Governor's School has operated all this year without a coach. If national championship/ magnet schools are having the same problem-- what in the world is going on?

I can't speak for TJ's issues of not having a coach this year, but I do know for a fact that that isn't really impacting their budget and ability to compete.

[hardeecoach]

I agree that TJ's lack of an "official" coach didn't seem to hurt them. I just can't imaginge that at a magnet school, there wasn't a faculty member waiting to jump at the chance.

For several years, there were no scholarships offered at CAC. This year, there were small ones-- certainly not enough to validate the cost of fielding a team, even if you won. The sponsorships from various corporations have dwindled to almost nothing. The loss of State Farm and Pepsi really impacted the tounament this year.

One problem in Florida is that many counties feel that academic competion means preparing for CAC. Therefore, they don't compete outside their own county or in any other format. I try to explain what we do as this: If we were a football team, we would play some games like football. Some games are like soccer, others are rugby. But we go to our state championship and play ice hockey. The goals are the same, but the rules and methodology are different in each one.

The one thing that will not change is the state tournament format. I really don't mind that at all. But I would like to see more involvement from school districts in NAQT or PACE style competition throughout the year!

[MrSchnippert]

I coached Stanton College Prep (Newsweek #2) to a district championship, but because there's no tradition, the kids are just pulled too thin to do other tourneys and the like. Three of my kids were on Duval's CAC team that went from terrible on Thursday to winning its semi room and being in 2nd place at the end of the 10pt round (if you were there, DAMN Polk was good). CAC is dying in Duval, as I can't coach, since I'm moving to a private school, and the current coach is very near retirement. Our district's competition is going to happen, but there is no coordinator now, and it will most likely be a neophyte. I remember the big deal about Indian River's coach at the CAC banquet. Hardeecoach, you guys are quite impressive with your recent run down there, btw.

I agree with what hardeecoach says about CAC. Since that's the FHSAA sanctioned event, that's what other districts look at. I like your analogy about CAC. Our format is nothing like CAC, and we start practicing in January with a sole eye of teaching these kids to play the CAC game. They finally got it on Friday morning. The three state championship teams from Duval spent ALL YEAR practicing as a team, separately from their own school team. Clearly there's got to be something better. I know it's a division I problem, but I like that some districts send one school's team, rather than all-stars.

I am moving to a new school with essentially no program. They have a team of sophomores who only played JV in our district competition and placed second to my JV team at Stanton. They had no buzzers, and the Campbells books. That's all they had. They practiced once a week for 40 minutes. It's going to take a little bit of push to change things, but the sponsor I'm taking it over from basically told me they were begging for more practice time. I gave them some old NAQT lists I had, and got the school to spend about $700 on a new buzzer system and some questions. I'm going to try and do a tournament this fall, and hopefully one in the spring and then NAQT states. If the HSNCT is an option, we'll look at it when it happens, but I'd be surprised. My hope is to pull a couple other area schools into this with me. Literally no one in the Jax metro area does anything but district stuff and CAC.

I was on Duval's team as a student at what seemed to be the heyday of the scholarships, as they were 1500/750/500 in both years. $500 for the champs and nothing further is pretty sad. The head coach of Duval (and our moderator who works as a judge) seems pretty concerned about what will happen to CAC when Peggy retires after 2008. None of my kids were ever interested in the money, and the returning kids are busting their tails to do better next year, with nothing to motivate them but a drive to victory.

As to what to do to motivate them, I mentioned that I'm going to try and challenge other schools in my area to follow us into competition. I'm going to try and get some extra regional competition, even if it is on the scrimmage level, with hopes that it can grow from there. I don't know of anything else, but I'm also just getting into the real quizbowl world.

[Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN)]

Doesn this all mean that Panasonic's being reduced too? Especially with Herrod retiring?

[MrSchnippert]

We know Peggy's retiring, and she did have someone working with her, but these tournaments have been her babies. The head coach I worked with, who coached a team at all but one CAC, and Team Florida 2 or 3 times, is concerned at what will happen when she retires. There's nothing official out there, and I doubt there are any intentions of things going downhill, but we'll have to see. I'd be really surprised to see Peggy actually let go of these two when she retires, I expect she'll keep doing just CAC and PAC, and that's it.

[First Chairman]

I'd be interested if Peggy does let it go, but then again, there hasn't been much interest for this immediate PAC nationally. There just aren't as many teams that can afford to go to that competition.

[Byko]

I'd be interested if Peggy does let it go, but then again, there hasn't been much interest for this immediate PAC nationally. There just aren't as many teams that can afford to go to that competition.

One other thing that I think isn't helping it is the fact that PAC is so incredibly late this year. I can't think of a time when it's been any later (though others older and more experienced than I would probably be able to prove me wrong--feel free to do so). Rick Barry made a point earlier about having nationals (like PACE) around mid-June being a problem because it's so long after school's out and students have graduated. Another problem (from talking with Paul Cain at Ysleta, TX) is that summer school gets started, and some of these coaches are involved in that.

There are a lot of factors that are definitely hurting PAC this year. I think it might go back up slightly next year, but the money crunch is really squeezing PAC quite a bit, and it could get worse before long with QU lowering their entry fees as well.

[Saiem]

I will respond to Billy first, cause his statements are the only ones I really know about.

Ransom Everglades is pretty dang good from what I saw at the UF Spring tournament. They were certainly beatable though. I'm just wondering how sophomores could be that good. Its a really scary thought to think of where they'll be two years from now. Rickards didn't actually play them. We would've almost assuredly lost with our literal two person team at that tournament

Pensacola is an interesting story. I've never thought they were all that impressive until I saw them play in playoffs and finals. I particularly remember them decimating a decent team (Eastside A) in the finals at the FSU Fall Tournament, with something ridiculous like 8 out of the first 10 tossups and 6 were powers. But with that said, in our two meetings Rickards beat them once at UF Fall and we lost to them at the Chiles tournament (though, to be fair, it was the last match of the day, and the final had already been decided; we were both in it.). We played a three-way match with them and Lincoln in the final, and got torn up. They're a very good team, but if they're graduating anyone from their first team, that can only significantly help us. Did the big chinese guy graduate? Cause that'd help me out heh.

I'm always impressed at the sheer mass of teams that Eastside brings. And also, how all of them are pretty good. Thats a real sign of good coaching.

Rickards will be pretty solid this year, but we're tragic underperformers. We graduated one non-factor of a senior from a decent team. If anything we added more by subtraction, since our underclassmen were better. I look forward to winning some tournaments this year, especially with Lincoln out of the picture.

Florida High is definitely a force to be reckoned with. (Read: Mathew Byrd)

If Maclay came to tournaments, they'd be interesting to play. They can certainly upset many good teams.

Lincoln will be rebuilding for a solid year or two.

Leon High will be about the same as where it was last year. I have faith in their seniors.

I am interested in what the South Florida teams have. I look forward to hearing from the Hardee and Vero teams. I do hope you attend our tournament in October in Tallahassee.



[Shameless Advertisement] Rickards has two high school tournaments a year! We're even thinking of having a middle school tournament this year. Come to our two day invite in October. (Oct. 12-13) You know you want to. We'll be using NAQT IS-68.[\shameless advertisement]

[ValenciaQBowl]

I apologize in advance for sort of hijacking this thread, but the poster above (from Rickards) mentions perhaps having a middle school tournament. I've been asked by my daughter's school (a K-8 private) to help them get involved in middle school quizbowl, but some queries to local junior highs indicate that none around Central Florida have teams.

Is there any organization or contact person for middle school qb here in Florida? I'd appreciate any directions/suggestions anyone has. Otherwise I figure I'll have them scrimmage with high schools (who also seem to not be very organized or interested in the game here in Orange/Seminole counties--my repeated offers of a free, local HS tournament have been met with yawns).
--chris borglum

PS--If the poster above does indeed end up having a middle school tournament, I'd love to know: cborglum at valenciacc dot edu. Thanks.

[Saiem]

I'll keep you informed about a middle school tournament.

The only other middle school tournament I can think of is the Tallahassee Democrat Big Bend Brain Bowl tournament. Really easy questions, even for middle school, though they do a better job with middle school than with their high school tournament. At some point it just becomes insulting to the intelligence of high schoolers everywhere.

I don't know if there is any established organization concerning middle school quiz bowl, but there are many teams in the big bend area. I haven't actually heard of any other teams outside of the panhandle area, but thats perhaps because the premier tournament for them is a regional tournament. Theres a decent amount of interest for middle school qb in our area. I remember when I was in middle school, we had around 45 kids in our Brain Bowl club and I imagine its about the same size or larger. Scrimmaging, definitely play the local high school teams. The campbell's books are pretty useful for middle schoolers in terms of getting them adjusted to the canon.

[CoachJET]

Pensacola is an interesting story. I've never thought they were all that impressive until I saw them play in playoffs and finals. I particularly remember them decimating a decent team (Eastside A) in the finals at the FSU Fall Tournament, with something ridiculous like 8 out of the first 10 tossups and 6 were powers. But with that said, in our two meetings Rickards beat them once at UF Fall and we lost to them at the Chiles tournament (though, to be fair, it was the last match of the day, and the final had already been decided; we were both in it.). We played a three-way match with them and Lincoln in the final, and got torn up. They're a very good team, but if they're graduating anyone from their first team, that can only significantly help us. Did the big chinese guy graduate? Cause that'd help me out heh.

I know that PHS is returning two of its four starters, and they have a rising junior who will be joining the varsity team, and he's pretty good. So they should be tough again this year. But yes, the "big Chinese guy" (who is actually a "big Korean guy") has graduated.

[miamiqb]

There aren't too many people on these boards from Florida, but here goes nothing.

Ransom Everglades is probably the best team in the state. Unfortunately, they are located way in the south, while most hs quizbowl occurs in the Panhandle region. Nevertheless, their team at HSNCT finished 6-4, and was comprised of all sophomores.

Pensacola is becoming a quizbowl factory, producing good teams every year. Unfortunately, it appears they are losing their two best players, but I think their coach can help them rebound.

Rickards and Eastside will also probably be good next year. Unfortunately, they don't really compete on the national level.

Any other comments?

Just to toot my alma mater's horn a little bit, Ransom should be pretty scary this year. Unfortunately they lost Dr. Monk but the new coach has a lot of experience at Wash U and is actually getting the team to study independently and specialize, things that previous Ransom teams never did. I might go practice with them at some point just out of curiosity to see how good they are. Maybe I can convince them to go to ACF Fall as well.

[CoachJET]

I, for one, would simply love for there to be more tournaments in Florida. I know Florida State and UF run tournaments, and I know that more than 4 high school teams exist in the state. So why not have more tournaments hosted by high schools? I can provide questions--let me know if there's anything I can do to help create more of a circuit down there.

David: I have been trying to e-mail both you and Jessie about purchasing some competition questions for a tournament I am producing, but I'm not sure if my e-mails are getting through.

I was particularly interested in AI's PACE-style packets, but am ultimately interested in all options. Is there a better way to get in touch with you?

thanks,
Jonathan Thompson
Escambia County, Florida

[Byko]

I, for one, would simply love for there to be more tournaments in Florida. I know Florida State and UF run tournaments, and I know that more than 4 high school teams exist in the state. So why not have more tournaments hosted by high schools? I can provide questions--let me know if there's anything I can do to help create more of a circuit down there.

David: I have been trying to e-mail both you and Jessie about purchasing some competition questions for a tournament I am producing, but I'm not sure if my e-mails are getting through.

I was particularly interested in AI's PACE-style packets, but am ultimately interested in all options. Is there a better way to get in touch with you?

thanks,
Jonathan Thompson
Escambia County, Florida

Sorry--I've only recently had time to answer e-mails. I'll be sending a response to you either today or tomorrow.

[Saiem]

FSU Tournament Results
1st Pensacola A
2nd Florida High
3rd Chiles A
4th Leon A
5th Maclay
6th Lincoln A
7th Rickards A
8th Hardee A?

Uh so basically, Pensacola was totally owning the entire tournament, which was pretty amazing. They lost to Lincoln once, which was a fluke.

Florida High is nothing surprising, Matt Byrd is ridiculously good. Leading the field with 135 points a round.

Chiles A is continuing to surprise me. My criticism is that they play to the level of their opponent, which results in them losing to bad teams.

I didn't get to see Maclay play, but they're pretty good.

Meh to Leon, they're not especially good, but they'll continue to be top 5-8 at tournaments.

I'm kind of proud of my personal performance here. 6th place indy with 62 points a game is a record high... by about 35 points haha. It helped not having our best player there to eat all my tossups. But that largely explains our performance, since we lost to some of the second tier teams. yeahh, i'm not used to carrying a team?

Comments on questions: It was a very well written tournament with our region in mind. I'm sure alot of schools like brookwood or dorman would get 600 point scores on these packets, it was easy enough for us to do well, and to have every team not feel bad about their score much. Stingy powers though. I think I only got like 4 or 5 the entire tournament. It was a strong balance between teams averaging like 450 points or so, and the second tier teams averaging in the 340 range. Very good topic selection. Keep it the way it is. Consider having a spring tournament. I'm sure everyone would love to come.

[CoachJET]

Sorry--I've only recently had time to answer e-mails. I'll be sending a response to you either today or tomorrow.

David --- Me again. Sorry to be a pest but I need to get my invites out very early this week. Can you field the questions from my previous two e-mails? (Dated Nov 5 and Oct 31. Did you even get them? If not, let me know and I will re-send them.)

Thanks,
--jt

[tomburr]

After playing at the UF Winter Tournament this weekend, I was amazed at how much had changed with Florida teams. A lot of the powerhouses of last year were gone and some new ones coming up.

[Saiem]

There was alot to love or hate with this tournament. The lines of communication were clearly very sketchy since it appeared that noone was responding to emails or answering the messageboards. Personally Rickards didn't have too much of a problem with this since we've been pretty familiar with the tournament director over the years. I did not appreciate the huge costs for teams. It is pretty lame. We still brought 4 teams, which was alot of fun.

The actual tournament started pretty late. The initial starting late is generally pretty expected, but the delays between the rounds was pretty outstanding as well. That certainly was a drawback on the tournament. The tournament itself had a good difficulty of questions, but the printing/errors were pretty tough on moderators. It was still pretty easy, I must say.

Our bracket was pretty easy. Eastside was pretty overrated. We beat them by a solid 200 or so.

Taylor County beat Pensacola? whats up with that. I mean I know Nafees (their main guy) is decent, but Pensacola even without Travis should be able to handle them.

Florida High was not surprising. Neither was South Fork.

South Fork was not as good as I thought they would be. I think they were missing people too.

Florida High didn't exactly impress in the playoffs and finals. Far too close for their liking, I'd assume. They did make the finals pretty close though. We didn't play our best.

It was an interesting tournament. I'll be there again in the spring.


Lincoln lost their best teams.
Eastside is on the decline?
Pensacola was without one of their two best players.
Outside of that, yeah, it isn't much else new.

[wd4gdz]

I look forward to seeing a Rickards v. Pensacola match with both teams at full strength. Florida High is pretty good as well, but it's hard to be great with just, essentially, one player.

[CoachJET]

I, for one, would simply love for there to be more tournaments in Florida. I know Florida State and UF run tournaments, and I know that more than 4 high school teams exist in the state. So why not have more tournaments hosted by high schools? I can provide questions--let me know if there's anything I can do to help create more of a circuit down there.

David: I have been trying to e-mail both you and Jessie about purchasing some competition questions for a tournament I am producing, but I'm not sure if my e-mails are getting through.

I was particularly interested in AI's PACE-style packets, but am ultimately interested in all options. Is there a better way to get in touch with you?

thanks,
Jonathan Thompson
Escambia County, Florida

Sorry--I've only recently had time to answer e-mails. I'll be sending a response to you either today or tomorrow.

David:

Communication breakdown again, I think. I've been trying to e-mail you...not sure if you're getting them. Anyway, I sent you another one today about receiving the PACE-style question packets for my tournament. Wondering if you'd gotten it.

thanks,
J. Thompson

[Saiem]

Well, our last tournament was quite a while back, so I thought I would reflect real quick.

Final Rankings
1. South Fork
2. Pensacola
3. Ransom Everglades
4. Rickards
5. Florida High
6. Chiles
7. Hardee
8. Eastside
9. Lincoln
10. Like anyone, mostly because I've started to forget who is good, and I have a rather norflor skew.

South Fork: I am very impressed by Tom's improvement from UF Winter to UF Spring. That is a large basis for this high ranking, because it is more holistic than most rankings. I mean, they absolutely destroyed us at UF Spring. While we were shorthanded, and it was NAQT, I don't really take that lightly, because there wasn't any way it was going to be close. They also played pretty conservative at CAC and managed to pull a nice win out. They're pretty much done after this year though.

Pensacola: I am never disappointed with a team that Mr. Robinson produces. Zach and Travis have not sucked this year, but I don't think they are as strong without the epic Hansol. Great mastery of stock clues. I didn't really feel like they improved as the year went on. They have a nice JV player whose name I don't really remember, but he was pretty decent. Played great at the FSU tournament.

Ransom Everglades: While they did pull of what I thought was an improbable NAQT win, I was not impressed overall with this team. They strongly benefit from the heavy geography distro in NAQT. I would love to see them on a house written tournament, in order to get a stronger judgement of them. We played them pretty close at UF Spring, which is laughable considering how terribly we were playing. They have another year of dominance left if Jesse is still there, and they only go to UF Spring.

Rickards: The team dynamic changed alot this year, as our best player basically stopped caring after December. I improved as the year went on, as did our literature girl, who I think will dominate on the Rickards team next year. I think I improved from FSU to UF Winter, despite the drop in PPG from 62 to 35. At FSU, I didn't have the aforementioned best player and literature girl, but the incredible FA distro at UF definitely contributed to how well Rickards did. From UF Winter to UF Spring, not really much improvement. There was a ton of negging at UF Spring that kind of sucked/took my questions. Also, I suck when there isn't really a RMP/FA distro... and when there is a 17/17 geography distro. At FSU spring, against a weak field, me and our lit girl, Emily, put up 96 ppg together on an NAQT set.

Florida High: Matt is never a surprise, though I'm worried that he is going after too much of a breadth of knowledge, rather than depth of knowledge. His depth of knowledge could get to be an issue if he continues to play in college.

Chiles: Always a surprise. Jeremy kept that team together. Improbable upsets on a number of occasions. They play to the level of their opponent, which gets to be an issue, but is also why they're a surprise.

Hardee: Fun kids. Zakk is pretty good.

Eastside: Their best player never showed up. Josie is pretty cool?

Lincoln: They'll be competent with a generalist and a science/euro specialist.

Meh. I don't care enough about the rest of the teams.