Roster Cuts

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D-SAR
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Roster Cuts

Post by D-SAR »

What is an acceptable roster size for a jr. high scholastic bowl team? Last year's coach had 18 try out for 7th grade and kept 10. I believe 8th grade also had about the same number of players try out and 10 were kept.
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Matthew D
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Post by Matthew D »

Okay personally, I usually can't handle over 12-15 for each team.. I have JH and HS so I have to limit. If I had help with practice, I would go up to about 24-25 max if they were willing to put in the effort for practice, studying, and travel..
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Post by sweaver »

I do not believe in cutting, and our school has a no-cut policy.
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Post by Sen. Estes Kefauver (D-TN) »

NKC doesn't cut. However, we rarely get people to come in and do it seriously.
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Matthew D
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Post by Matthew D »

Just wondering on the no cut policy.. how many players do you normal have come out for the team?
The only reason that I end up "cutting" anyone is that there comes a point where my practices look to much like chaos not controlled chaos.. due to the fact that I am a one person show for practices..
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Howard
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Post by Howard »

I've had teams with as many as 15 - 20 active players, but I do not recall having that number of people present at any one practice. I've never had a practice reach the point where it was uncontrollable due to the number of students.

I must say, though, that I'm firmly against cutting people from the team. If it ever came to a point that I had too many students to maintain order, I'd appoint two or three of the students my assistant and have one of those students take charge of the having a separate practice for the lower half of students. Some candidates for this would be seniors who aren't quite up to the level of the A team. This gives them an additional involvement in the club they wouldn't have had otherwise. Other candidates might be underclasspersons who would be expected to move up to the A team the following year. While this formant wouldn't give them the all the benefits of playing time, it'll broaden their exposure to clues and answers.
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Post by Stained Diviner »

I am also against cutting. I have had kids who were not good enough to contribute to the Frosh/Soph Team when they were sophomores but then improved to the point where they could contribute to the Varsity Team when they were juniors. Some kids are slow on the buzzer but willing to learn.

We have a couple of buzzer systems, and we get two practices going at once when there are a lot of students--some years that's almost every practice and other years that's rarely. Of course, with junior high kids, it might be more difficult to put ten of them in a room and expect good things to happen.
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Post by Frater Taciturnus »

It is a GLORIOUS year when we have 10 show up EVER. So, we've never had a chance to be lucky enough to deal with that issue. But I say cut only when you can't handle anymore people.
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Post by Tegan »

Even ith our numbers exploding, I have resisted cutting, though I have come close. As long as the people show up, and want to work, AND don' complain about playing time, then I don't have a problem .....
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Post by jrbarry »

I have a simple rule. Never have more people on your team than you have buzzers available for every practice.

I have 18-20 on my varsity team every year because I have two coaches with 2, 10-player buzzer systems.

I also let every freshman who wants to participate on my freshman team. We'll see how the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects my freshman turnout. As an aside, I fully expect that school, which starts with freshmen only this fall, to destroy quiz bowl as we know it in the most active quiz bowl area in Georgia. It'll take 3-5 years to do that dirty deed though. I do plan to "fight it" and the Brookwood Academic Team will survive if it's the last thingt I do! :-)
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Post by BuzzerZen »

jrbarry wrote:We'll see how the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects my freshman turnout. As an aside, I fully expect that school, which starts with freshmen only this fall, to destroy quiz bowl as we know it in the most active quiz bowl area in Georgia.
I hope to dispute your proposition that having a magnet school will "destroy quiz bowl as you know it" in your area. Quiz bowl in Virginia manages to be pretty active even with TJ and Maggie Walker, both magnets, dominating the scene. I obviously don't know the demographics of your area or the size of the new school, but it seems unlikely that its creation will drain every potential quiz bowl talent from every other area high school.

I hope I am right in thinking you have no animosity toward the educational mission of magnet schools--my experience at one has been extremely positive. It is a fallacy to think that magnet schools drain resources from the rest of the school system; our facility is ancient and inadequate, much of our equipment is out of date, and our days of "corporate sponsorship" are far in the past. Whether the people creating them know it or not, the point of a magnet school is really to bring together a lot (though by know means all) of an area's bright students. I've had bad classes and bad teachers at TJ, just like kids do everywhere, but the people around me have been the real experience.

Um, rant over.
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Post by grapesmoker »

Um, rant over.
No.
jrbarry wrote:the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects
I don't know the specifics of high school politics in your state, but I can't imagine any circumstances in which it would be acceptable to smear students of a magnet school as "maggots." Maybe you have some reasonable objections to the existence of the school itself, but there are better ways to voice them than what you wrote here. As a teacher, you should be ashamed of yourself.
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Post by jrbarry »

Mr Grapesmoker:

You are right. You know nothing of the politics of GA schools or Gwinnett County in particular. Nor, apparently, can you recognize a joke when you see one (oops!).

And, for anyone who cares, the GMST school is building a state of the art building which they will move into in 2009. The cost of the building is twice per square foot what the two newest high schools now under construction are. Its per pupli funding level exceeds what the rest of us get. And the County BOE has allowed GMST to be a charter school after refusing my school TWICE when we wanted to pursue charter status. In fact, that new school has been given permission to use a schedule we tried to use TWICE but were refused by the County BOE. I could go on, but I will not bore you anymore than I already have.

On the quiz bowl front, the new school will have county-funded quiz bowl while the rest of us poor ole regular schools will still be forced to raise ALL our own fiunding. Think that is annoying?

I think, after 21 years in Gwinnett County, GA promoting quiz bowl at my school and others, I am entitled to a JOKE at the new school's expense.
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Post by STPickrell »

BuzzerZen wrote:
jrbarry wrote:We'll see how the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects my freshman turnout. As an aside, I fully expect that school, which starts with freshmen only this fall, to destroy quiz bowl as we know it in the most active quiz bowl area in Georgia.
I hope to dispute your proposition that having a magnet school will "destroy quiz bowl as you know it" in your area. Quiz bowl in Virginia manages to be pretty active even with TJ and Maggie Walker, both magnets, dominating the scene.
FWIW, I read it as a joke, but now knowing some of the other issues, some degree of resentment/annoyance may well be justified.

In addition, the talent level at other Virginia schools has by no means suffered. Cave Spring and George Mason, made it to the NAQT playoffs and Collegiate went 5-5. Mason won Group A in a runaway but Cave Spring finished tied for fifth at AA states. (George Mason was missing their captain at NAQT as well!)

Here's some other schools that would've gone at least 4-6 at HSNCT, the ones I mark as 'probable' probably would've made the playoffs. I also factor in experience, and so VHSL-only schools might've not done as well had this been their first tournament.

Group A: Radford and Mathews (possible)
Group AA: Charlottesville and Heritage (probable); Tabb and Monticello (possible)
Group AAA: Princess Anne and Ocean Lakes (probable); Henrico, Freeman, Woodson, Robinson, Hayfield, Hampton (finished 3rd at Eastern regions behind PA and OL) (possible)

George Mason, Freeman, Henrico, Woodson, Robinson, and Hayfield are in areas that are served by TJ and Gov.
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Post by Frater Taciturnus »

StPickrell wrote:
BuzzerZen wrote:
jrbarry wrote:We'll see how the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects my freshman turnout. As an aside, I fully expect that school, which starts with freshmen only this fall, to destroy quiz bowl as we know it in the most active quiz bowl area in Georgia.
I hope to dispute your proposition that having a magnet school will "destroy quiz bowl as you know it" in your area. Quiz bowl in Virginia manages to be pretty active even with TJ and Maggie Walker, both magnets, dominating the scene.
FWIW, I read it as a joke, but now knowing some of the other issues, some degree of resentment/annoyance may well be justified.

In addition, the talent level at other Virginia schools has by no means suffered. Cave Spring and George Mason, made it to the NAQT playoffs and Collegiate went 5-5. Mason won Group A in a runaway but Cave Spring finished tied for fifth at AA states. (George Mason was missing their captain at NAQT as well!)

Here's some other schools that would've gone at least 4-6 at HSNCT, the ones I mark as 'probable' probably would've made the playoffs. I also factor in experience, and so VHSL-only schools might've not done as well had this been their first tournament.

Group A: Radford and Mathews (possible)
Group AA: Charlottesville and Heritage (probable); Tabb and Monticello (possible)
Group AAA: Princess Anne and Ocean Lakes (probable); Henrico, Freeman, Woodson, Robinson, Hayfield, Hampton (finished 3rd at Eastern regions behind PA and OL) (possible)

George Mason, Freeman, Henrico, Woodson, Robinson, and Hayfield are in areas that are served by TJ and Gov.
FWIW, Freeman and Henrico have their own "mini-magnet" specialty centers that they draw from, that they draw heavily upon. Henrico draws all the county IB studetns not at Gov. and Freeman gets the "Leadership" center, which gives usa bunch of people decent at geography and other SS, but not much else.
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Post by btressler »

I am going to buck the trend and admit that I am cutting for the first time next year.

- At the beginning of the year, we found 40 at practice to be too many, even with three rooms running. Fortunately I had attrition.

- An even bigger challenge that we faced was entry into tournaments. While many of the Washimore schools are good about letting me enter 5, 6, or 7 teams, the same is not true when we travel the other direction. Rutgers, Princeton, and Lancaster area are usually two teams only. Heck, even the tournaments I run I have to sometimes to limit due to resources and fairness.

For the first time this year, we split the squad and sent people to different tournaments on the same day. That worked, but it's not something I want to do every week.

- Also, a bus seats like 40 or so. There's no way I'm ever going to ask for more than one bus.

So about 30 seems like a manageable number.

Oh and when some newspaper did an article about the state of TJ's building, it was posted in Charter's faculty lounge. We're modeled after TJ and knowingly understood the challenges that were described. We too are politically unpopular in some circles because we attract kids that would boost other school's test scores. In my classroom, every time it rains we put buckets out for the leaks (and it's a computer lab!).
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Post by ieppler »

Stat74 wrote: 40 at practice
:shock:

I think that's more than Georgetown Day has had on its team in 10 years. If you don't mind me asking, how do you recruit enough people to have 40 at practice? Maybe this would be better in a separate thread.
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Post by quizbowllee »

I've never had a high school try-out. There have always been a few players to move up from my middle school team. However, I do have to make cuts there. I've had as many as 60 try out in middle school, of which I kept 12. Of course, many of them just wanted to get out of class.

I had 13 high school players this year and I have 4 moving up from 8th to 9th grade this coming year. I feel like I'm reaching my limit. Ideally I would like to keep the team around 12 players. But, I can't bring myself to cut players who have been with me for a number of years. Unfortunately, it becomes very expensive to take multiple teams to tournaments. Also, some tournaments won't LET us bring multiple teams...

I also think I could make a much stronger team if I only had about 8-10 players that I could completely focus on...
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Post by btressler »

Hopper wrote:I think that's more than Georgetown Day has had on its team in 10 years. If you don't mind me asking, how do you recruit enough people to have 40 at practice? Maybe this would be better in a separate thread.
It's a snowball effect of:

- Being at a magnet school where the kids want to do this.

- Actually paying attention to the kids I coach. The former teacher gave the kids a book and told them to work in the corner. The team had about 10 students five years ago.

- Pulling out the buzzers during class sometimes and reading questions, especially when I teach freshmen. (like that last day before Christmas or when a majority of the class is on a field trip)

- Getting people's siblings, friends, etc.

- And finally, the middle school tournament that we've done three years is also a draw. Students came to our school, met our team, and competed on questions we wrote. So they know something about us.

And BTW, I interviewed at Georgetown Day School for a math job in 1999. Didn't get it, somebody else in the pool was not fresh out of school.
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Post by jrbarry »

We had 39 kids tryout for 10 open positions on our varsity team back in early May. I once had almost 100 kids tryout for 10-15 open positions on the team.
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Post by quizbowllee »

grapesmoker wrote:
Um, rant over.
No.
jrbarry wrote:the new Gwinnett County maggot (oops!) high school affects
I don't know the specifics of high school politics in your state, but I can't imagine any circumstances in which it would be acceptable to smear students of a magnet school as "maggots." Maybe you have some reasonable objections to the existence of the school itself, but there are better ways to voice them than what you wrote here. As a teacher, you should be ashamed of yourself.
You see what he did there??? He said "maggot" instead of magnet. Get it? It's a joke!

Lighten up.
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Post by Duke Togo »

quizbowllee wrote:You see what he did there??? He said "maggot" instead of magnet. Get it? It's a joke!
...
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