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Announcement: Princeton High School Tournament - 11/20/2004

Posted: Mon Aug 09, 2004 8:53 pm
by DanTheClam
The Princeton College Bowl Club is proud to announce the Twelfth Annual Princeton High School Tournament, to be held on Saturday, November 20, 2004.

As usual, the tournament will be hosted on NAQT Invitational Series questions, with the specific set to be announced after completing arrangements with NAQT, and will be in untimed NAQT format (20 tossup questions with bonuses).

$100 for the first team from a school.
$80 for each additional team
-$20 Discount per Moderator
-$10 Discount per Buzzer System

There is a maximum discount of $50 per school, and a maximum of three teams are allowed from any given school. Any travel discounts can be discussed with the tournament director.

The planned field cap is 60 teams, but this may be extended depending on interest. The tournament format will be a bracketed round-robin, followed by single-elimination playoffs among the top 16 teams.

For further information or to obtain an entry form, please e-mail tournament director Dan Benediktson, dbenedik (at) princeton [dot] edu. We hope to see you there.

Dan Benediktson
Princeton College Bowl Vice-President

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 10:53 am
by DanTheClam
Just another reminder about the Princeton High School Tournament, to be held Saturday, November 20, 2004. We currently have 27 teams registered, and the tournament is filling up fast.

The tournament is to be run on NAQT IS 46, and will feature a 12-game round robin, followed by four-rounds of single-elimination to determine the champion.

If your team is interested, please request an entry form from Tournament Director Dan Benediktson at dbenedik (at) princeton (dot) edu.

Dan Benediktson
Princeton College Bowl Vice-President

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:10 pm
by jewtemplar
Aren't there only 15 rounds in an naqt set?

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:48 pm
by DanTheClam
In light of the very much appreciated comment from jewtemplar, I've realized that when you have 12-team brackets, as we had planned, that implies an 11-round Round Robin (yeah. I didn't put quite enough thought into that one). Hence:

CORRECTION: Princeton's High School tournament will consist of an 11-round Round Robin, in 5 brackets of 12 teams, followed by 4 rounds of single elimination competition among the top 16 teams.

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:16 pm
by No Sollositing On Premise
Eleven rounds of prelims? That's going to require some nationals-level endurance...

Posted: Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:25 pm
by jewtemplar
Substantially more than nationals, actually, especially when you consider playoffs, but there shouldn't be too much wait time if no swiss-pairing is done.

number of rounds

Posted: Wed Oct 13, 2004 8:57 pm
by btressler
If I may, and this could rightfully be its own thread...

As a college player, I was used to 10+ rounds a tournament. Heck, I remember a GW event when we did 15 in one day, and were still on the road by 6pm. In fact, I also seem to recall an event where people only played 8 rounds and complained they drove too many miles to play only 8 rounds.

So when I started running high school tournaments, I would schedule 9 rounds (with a final round 10 if necessary). And I heard a chorus of "it's too long".

I also didn't do playoffs, the team with the best record won, period. College teams don't like single-elim playoffs, especially when an 8-4 knocks off a 12-0. They grumble that it isn't fair. But playoffs make a ton of sense at high school events with 40, 50, or 60 teams. In fact, any chance that Princeton will consider double-octos (round of 32) again this year?

After two years of that, Dave Balseiro of UD and I brainstormed and decided to try a playoff system. We did 6 prelims, followed by 3 outrounds. Teams not in the top 8 could stay for consolation rounds if they wished. I heard less complaining after trying this, and have stuck with it since fall 2002.

I did some data mining after that tournament and tracked the quarterfinalist teams' prorgression through the day. Even by round 3, the top 8 teams were pretty much the same teams who were in the top 8 after six rounds (this field only had 16). And certainly after 5 rounds, really only 1-2 teams were affected by winning or losing round 6.

So now I only do 5 prelims, and to decrease the effect of the bubble, all 3-2 teams at my events go to playoffs. Thus, now the 9th place team never goes home because they had 10 less points than seed 8. Teams are still welcome to stay for consolation rounds (and some do, but many choose to start their trip home).

Another point I can't stress enough is that at some events, 30 minutes is not enough time for a round (especially untimed tournaments). More often than not, tournaments running 30-minute rounds run late. (but there are exceptions, see TJIAT 2004) My own events block 40 minutes a round, and I don't think I've run late in quite a while. Sometimes we even get to lunch early.

Having shared TD wisdom, I personally have zero objection with my students playing 11 prelims. I think it would be a great chance to meet a lot of other teams. However, it could very well make a long day, and by round 9 some 0-8 or 1-7 teams might decide they'd like to go home.

- Bill Tressler,
Charter School of Wilmington

Posted: Sun Oct 17, 2004 9:09 pm
by Willy Dee Jones McGee III
Uberaschung: If you ever post on this board again, I will write a letter to your coach and your school's principal with all of your posts attached. -Admin