Cody wrote:Actually Dave Madden threaten to sue anyone or any organization that Matt Weiner might work with without satisfying his extremely weird demands for breaking the contract.
Then you hold a bad opinion and should feel bad for holding it.Corry wrote:Cody wrote:Actually Dave Madden threaten to sue anyone or any organization that Matt Weiner might work with without satisfying his extremely weird demands for breaking the contract.
I personally don't see a problem with that case, actually.
The fact that several tournaments at IHO were being written immediately before they were happening is an absolute organizational failure. Futhermore, this kind of thing keeps happening with NHBB, and it cannot continue to happen if NHBB wants to be representative of good academic competition. This is made worse by the fact that several writers at IHO were frantically trying to finish the tournament while other NHBB staffers were soaking in Hawaii; this is quite distasteful to any notion of fairness (to be clear, this appears to be an organizational issue and not an instance of staffers shirking their duties).
The writing corps for NHBB is not nearly on par with those of PACE, NAQT, HSAPQ, or ACF. I regret having to call out particular people, but examples are instructive. Examples like the editor of the scramble event, Arthur Lee, believing that a tossup on the 2016 Harvard Measles outbreak was a good idea (then ignoring my comments stating as much), and volume-writer (and I use the term "writer" with distaste) Andrew Leung spamming ~60 questions that look like they'd been Gibson-assembled from lists of named things on Wikipedia. The latter is particularly frustrating for me personally, as I had to fix those questions, for which he will be paid more than I would for basically re-writing them. These things would not be even remotely acceptable in other quizbowl organizations, but because we were in dire straits, all hands were on deck.
This lack of prioritization of writing is reflected in the way money is spent within NHBB. The writing and editing fees for NHBB are not on par with peer quizbowl organizations (even though for editors, its far more work - see above bullet point), yet Madden has enough money to jet-set around the globe with Niki Peters, Shravan Balaji, and Raynell Cooper, to pay for high quality ping-pong paddles, etc.
Finally, IHO was made patently worse by the fact that, on top of several of the events not being completed before people landing in Hawaii, Dave Madden demanded over 100 questions for a hybrid ping-pong/quizbowl event that only a week before, writers were told to "not worry about"; it seems he *in particular* wanted them written as IHO was ongoing. Furthermore, several of these questions were apparently recycled from previous sets. I don't know if this is a consequence of the breakneck pace, or by design, but either way it's horrifying. This demonstrates a huge lack of respect for writers, for the writing process, the quality of his events, and for basic axioms of how quizbowl works.
The cult of Mithras was centered in this region. Rhadamistus, an usurper of Parthia, hailed from this region, and an inscription from Mtskheta describes how Mihdrat I freely accepted Roman control over this region. The Chosroid dynasty ruled over this region following the treaty of Nisibis, though it would later be ceded to Persia in the Peace of Aciliscene. The Pharnavazid dynasty ruled this region located east of Colchis. Tbilisi was the last capital of, For the point, what region of the Southern Caucasus centered in present day Georgia?
Answer: Iberia
Cody wrote:Then you hold a bad opinion and should feel bad for holding it.Corry wrote:Cody wrote:Actually Dave Madden threaten to sue anyone or any organization that Matt Weiner might work with without satisfying his extremely weird demands for breaking the contract.
I personally don't see a problem with that case, actually.
GOODCOMPANY88 wrote:For editing the Ancient History Bee—130 questions in total—I will be paid less than a dollar per tossup I edited. This is particularly little considering the quality of submissions I had to edit.
GOODCOMPANY88 wrote: A team of me, Arthur Lee, Brad Fischer, and Ankit Aggarwal spent our time in Hawaii in a dorm lounge around the clock cranking out questions for events, some of which weren't even one-third completed at the commencement of IHO. Adding insult to injury, the other staffers went out to Waikiki, sipped cocktails and margaritas, and played basketball while we were saving the tournament by writing questions. As for staffers, there were some questionable choices of people who were brought to Hawaii—in particular, Robin Richards, who has shady history (https://www.qbwiki.com/wiki/view/Robin_Richards), and Kendall Stewart, who had no prior experience moderating as far as I could tell, rather than the cadres of writers that helped IHO run at all.
Cheynem wrote:Corry, you really think it's okay for Dave Madden to sue a company that Matt Weiner writes for because he failed to accomplish a project for NHBB?
So you get it and you don't agree with it and you don't think he would have done it BUT your earlier post says you are totally fine with it.Corry wrote:Cheynem wrote:Corry, you really think it's okay for Dave Madden to sue a company that Matt Weiner writes for because he failed to accomplish a project for NHBB?
I guess I'll rephrase myself. I always saw the threat as, well, a thing that Dave said when he was pissed. And rightfully so-- at Matt Weiner! I don't believe Dave actually intended to sue any other companies, but people say lots of things when they're hopping mad. I get that.
Anyways, I don't have anything to say about Bunnie's case, but I think it's disingenuous for folks like Cody to use Matt Weiner as an "example" of a case where Dave has wronged people. I'm sure plenty of those cases exist. But in the Weiner case, Dave is the guy who got screwed here.
Bunnie wrote:FWIW, I backed out of my "commitment" to work for you when I took emergency custody of my one-and-a-half year old nephew, which prompted you to ask, and I quote " Are you really taking care of an infant all day, every day?" Along with a number of other invasive and inappropriate questions when I tendered my resignation, including "can we please just deal with this like adults?" because you didn't think a professional letter of resignation was dealing with a professional resignation like an adult.
Bunnie wrote:stuff about NDA and non compete clauses.
Ike wrote:Set 2: This stuffBunnie wrote:FWIW, I backed out of my "commitment" to work for you when I took emergency custody of my one-and-a-half year old nephew, which prompted you to ask, and I quote " Are you really taking care of an infant all day, every day?" Along with a number of other invasive and inappropriate questions when I tendered my resignation, including "can we please just deal with this like adults?" because you didn't think a professional letter of resignation was dealing with a professional resignation like an adult.Bunnie wrote:stuff about NDA and non compete clauses.
I actually had to read this three or four times just to make sure that I wasn't dreaming. Let's just look at this from a purely theoretical scenario: Employee A feels that her Employer, Mr. B, asked invasive, insensitive, and honestly just an appalling question that constitutes something very close to Family Responsibilities Discrimination. Employee A now wants to consult a friend and a lawyer about this, but cannot do so unless Employee A gets permission from alleged discriminator Mr. B permission to discuss it, otherwise Employee A might get sued.
That should be frightening to everyone who is reading this thread! I don't know the particular specifics about what happened in Bunnie's case, but I'm not gonna lie, the existence of a NDA that is so free-ranging coupled with the unsavory comments on Dave's behavior upthread horrifies me. If Bunnie's case is some kind of misunderstanding or false, by all means, clear it up or say something about it NHBB! If Bunnie's story is true, then I don't know how you can't take the position of Cody Voight and Matt Jackson in this thread.
Adm Akbar says It's a Tarp! wrote:He asked if I could get about 5 others in my area, train them on the format and drive them to DC.
psychological cat wrote:Adm Akbar says It's a Tarp! wrote:He asked if I could get about 5 others in my area, train them on the format and drive them to DC.
I have the experience of being one of these people "in the area" for Bunnie, who drove me to DC to help as a volunteer for Nationals in 2015. I was strictly a volunteer and expected no payment, as I felt enough in debt for getting to DC for free. At the end of a week of 16-20 hour days, David Madden thanked me with a completely unexpected check for $700. I had signed no paperwork, had agreed to no contracting positions, and had expected no payment or reward. I was very grateful and was overwhelmed by the gift - much needed for a 22 year old graduate student.
Fast forward 7 months, and I received an e-mail about needing to supply my SSN to be given proper tax documents to file for my "payment of over $600" from NHBB earlier in the year. I was being treated as an independent contractor for NHBB despite having never entered into any agreements dictating that I would receive compensation for services rendered, verbal or written. I had been under the assumption it was being given as a gift, which is not taxable unless it exceeds an amount of $12,000. Only independent contractors should be issued a 1099.
I would have been HAPPY to have signed paperwork ahead of time or have entered into any written agreement at the time establishing me as an independent contractor in order to receive a sum of money reflective of approximately 120 hours worked. I would have been happy to receive an amount as a gift that was under any amount that could have been considered grounds for a 1099, if the distinction had been made clear and up front. I had not been expecting anything and felt so grateful to have been so appreciated. 7 months later it turned out to be a huge inconvenience for me as I talked with accountants to figure out the proper course of action (not supplying my SSN because if I had ever been an official paid volunteer or contractor, he should have had it before payment). **FYI - I had it checked and declaring that income on a 1099 would have decreased my tax return by $150 (I would have saved money and trouble if David Madden had just given a gift of $599).
This falls under Set 1 of the 2 categories mentioned a couple of posts above. From my very limited experience, and reading from others, it seems that, especially in the case of NHBB, you need to be very careful with how experienced you are in contract and employment law to ensure that you aren't potentially going to be taken advantage of through underpay, ridiculous contract clauses, and unexpected gifts considered 'payment'. I don't think David Madden willfully intended to make my life difficult by giving me "too much" money, and I still appreciate the fact that I was given anything at all. But there are many other ways this could have been handled that would have shown better organization and handling on the financial aspects to conducting a business, and I hope closer consideration is given to these issues in the future.
User reminded to add signature. -mgmt
luke1865 wrote:This whole thread seems highly unprofessional in my opinion. These sorts of issues should not be discussed on the internet for everyone to see. This is basic business etiquette. I am not in any way trying to defend NHBB. I don't know anything about its inner workings, but I have always enjoyed participating in NHBB/IHBB events. This issue of a lack of professionalism is honestly pervasive in quizbowl, and is something that really should be worked on. I am not trying to call any individuals or either "side" out; this is a general issue.
Dominator wrote:I have some experience working for NHBB, although I'm not sure I want to wade into this thread. Why does this thread exist and not a similar one for NAQT, HSAPQ, etc.? I'd legitimately like to know what working for them is like, and I'm not sure why NHBB is singled out here.
Great Bustard wrote:For what it’s worth, after consulting with my lawyer, both he and I came to the conclusion that it’s not worth my time or energy to pursue any lawsuit against Bunnie (or anyone else) regarding non-disclosure agreements, unless it’s a matter of disclosing confidential business plans and financial information. I would imagine that other organizations in quiz bowl also have similar policies. While unhelpful, Bunnie’s comments clearly don’t rise to that standard.
Great Bustard wrote:Otherwise, the point of a non-disclosure agreement is largely to avoid having one’s name dragged through the mud by an ex-employee (or independent contractor – the difference isn’t really relevant here). In any case, that cat is both out of the bag, and honestly, it’s not really that important, since I believe our actions (namely the tournaments we run, and the enjoyable time participants have at them) speak louder than any words from someone no longer involved ever could.
Great Bustard wrote:If you’re reading this thread, and are genuinely interested in what working for NHBB/IHBB is like, I strongly encourage you to reach out to Brad Fischer, Kristin Strey, Raynell Cooper, Niki Peters, Shravan Balaji, Marshall Mullins, Chris White, Joe Su, or numerous other people. I’m happy to put you in touch with them. With a few rare exceptions, most of which are known to most readers on these forums, I’ve had good working relationships with almost everyone who has worked for NHBB/IHBB including those who no longer do. I think most people have appreciated the opportunity to earn a fair amount while doing something inherently enjoyable.
AZQuizbowl wrote:FWIW, I backed out of my "commitment" to work for you when I took emergency custody of my one-and-a-half year old nephew, which prompted you to ask, and I quote " Are you really taking care of an infant all day, every day?"
TheDoctor wrote:I understand why he protects himself with these clauses, and he's been very considerate about allowing outside work, so long as he knows about it
AKKOLADE wrote:psychological cat wrote:Adm Akbar says It's a Tarp! wrote:He asked if I could get about 5 others in my area, train them on the format and drive them to DC.
I have the experience of being one of these people "in the area" for Bunnie, who drove me to DC to help as a volunteer for Nationals in 2015. I was strictly a volunteer and expected no payment, as I felt enough in debt for getting to DC for free. At the end of a week of 16-20 hour days, David Madden thanked me with a completely unexpected check for $700. I had signed no paperwork, had agreed to no contracting positions, and had expected no payment or reward. I was very grateful and was overwhelmed by the gift - much needed for a 22 year old graduate student.
Fast forward 7 months, and I received an e-mail about needing to supply my SSN to be given proper tax documents to file for my "payment of over $600" from NHBB earlier in the year. I was being treated as an independent contractor for NHBB despite having never entered into any agreements dictating that I would receive compensation for services rendered, verbal or written. I had been under the assumption it was being given as a gift, which is not taxable unless it exceeds an amount of $12,000. Only independent contractors should be issued a 1099.
I would have been HAPPY to have signed paperwork ahead of time or have entered into any written agreement at the time establishing me as an independent contractor in order to receive a sum of money reflective of approximately 120 hours worked. I would have been happy to receive an amount as a gift that was under any amount that could have been considered grounds for a 1099, if the distinction had been made clear and up front. I had not been expecting anything and felt so grateful to have been so appreciated. 7 months later it turned out to be a huge inconvenience for me as I talked with accountants to figure out the proper course of action (not supplying my SSN because if I had ever been an official paid volunteer or contractor, he should have had it before payment). **FYI - I had it checked and declaring that income on a 1099 would have decreased my tax return by $150 (I would have saved money and trouble if David Madden had just given a gift of $599).
This falls under Set 1 of the 2 categories mentioned a couple of posts above. From my very limited experience, and reading from others, it seems that, especially in the case of NHBB, you need to be very careful with how experienced you are in contract and employment law to ensure that you aren't potentially going to be taken advantage of through underpay, ridiculous contract clauses, and unexpected gifts considered 'payment'. I don't think David Madden willfully intended to make my life difficult by giving me "too much" money, and I still appreciate the fact that I was given anything at all. But there are many other ways this could have been handled that would have shown better organization and handling on the financial aspects to conducting a business, and I hope closer consideration is given to these issues in the future.
User reminded to add signature. -mgmt
None of this makes sense. Was this under a contract of employment? Gifts typically aren't given in exchange for labor; wages are given in exchange for labor.
touchpack wrote:AKKOLADE wrote:psychological cat wrote:Adm Akbar says It's a Tarp! wrote:He asked if I could get about 5 others in my area, train them on the format and drive them to DC.
I have the experience of being one of these people "in the area" for Bunnie, who drove me to DC to help as a volunteer for Nationals in 2015. I was strictly a volunteer and expected no payment, as I felt enough in debt for getting to DC for free. At the end of a week of 16-20 hour days, David Madden thanked me with a completely unexpected check for $700. I had signed no paperwork, had agreed to no contracting positions, and had expected no payment or reward. I was very grateful and was overwhelmed by the gift - much needed for a 22 year old graduate student.
Fast forward 7 months, and I received an e-mail about needing to supply my SSN to be given proper tax documents to file for my "payment of over $600" from NHBB earlier in the year. I was being treated as an independent contractor for NHBB despite having never entered into any agreements dictating that I would receive compensation for services rendered, verbal or written. I had been under the assumption it was being given as a gift, which is not taxable unless it exceeds an amount of $12,000. Only independent contractors should be issued a 1099.
I would have been HAPPY to have signed paperwork ahead of time or have entered into any written agreement at the time establishing me as an independent contractor in order to receive a sum of money reflective of approximately 120 hours worked. I would have been happy to receive an amount as a gift that was under any amount that could have been considered grounds for a 1099, if the distinction had been made clear and up front. I had not been expecting anything and felt so grateful to have been so appreciated. 7 months later it turned out to be a huge inconvenience for me as I talked with accountants to figure out the proper course of action (not supplying my SSN because if I had ever been an official paid volunteer or contractor, he should have had it before payment). **FYI - I had it checked and declaring that income on a 1099 would have decreased my tax return by $150 (I would have saved money and trouble if David Madden had just given a gift of $599).
This falls under Set 1 of the 2 categories mentioned a couple of posts above. From my very limited experience, and reading from others, it seems that, especially in the case of NHBB, you need to be very careful with how experienced you are in contract and employment law to ensure that you aren't potentially going to be taken advantage of through underpay, ridiculous contract clauses, and unexpected gifts considered 'payment'. I don't think David Madden willfully intended to make my life difficult by giving me "too much" money, and I still appreciate the fact that I was given anything at all. But there are many other ways this could have been handled that would have shown better organization and handling on the financial aspects to conducting a business, and I hope closer consideration is given to these issues in the future.
User reminded to add signature. -mgmt
None of this makes sense. Was this under a contract of employment? Gifts typically aren't given in exchange for labor; wages are given in exchange for labor.
I'm pretty sure what happened here was Madden intended to pay him (as labor), but didn't properly contract him or anything (due to his own incompetence), so it's effectively treated as a gift for tax purposes.
Al Hirt wrote:First off, it seems to be there's this duality where Dave is an employer who expects ridiculous things, but simultaneously lets his employees do whatever they please. Dave does expect results, but by and large he's flexible enough so as long as things get done, there's no issue. I've made mistakes before as I started to work for him, but he was quite patient and gave me plenty of rope to work with. I fixed those mistakes and it became a non-issue. This remains applicable from being a regional coordinator to international outreach.
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